soc.culture.usa
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa
soc.culture.usa@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* Uhh, ahhh, uhhh, ahhh, I'm too dumb to understand the question so I'll talk
about turirists - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e9233bdec0b183c4
* Of Jewish Dementia, Child-Murder & "Anti-Semitism" - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a0f87e092a7b73b5
* More than 100 suspected illegal immigrants found in 8 traffic incidents - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/7338c9a79b60b67e
* Afghan Man Sentenced to Death for Converting - 6 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/bd295e44b8e99935
* Dine and Dance at Karachi University - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/612b78692fd8323c
* Cuban Conference Focuses on Elder Care - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3a7ce9372ec23e22
* Is the US getting it's ass kicked again? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/c3e720f581a7b047
* Castro is to the Cuban people what Hitler is to the Jews - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/8ece78896aa2d7af
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Uhh, ahhh, uhhh, ahhh, I'm too dumb to understand the question so I'll
talk about turirists
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e9233bdec0b183c4
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 9:31 pm
From: "Furious George"
Anti Theist wrote:
> Terrorists?
>
> HA! What about the MILLIONS of deaths I'm responsible for EVERY time I jerk
> off?
Don't worry about them. They would have been just like you. No big
loss to society.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Of Jewish Dementia, Child-Murder & "Anti-Semitism"
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a0f87e092a7b73b5
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 9:31 pm
From: "Hal Womack 3-dan"
Immediately below = the response I sent over an hour ago to the HAARETZ
article on the Israeli army's promotion from the rank of captain to
major and financial award to the officer who machine-gunnned 13
year-old Iman al-Hams as she was walking to school in October of 2005.
There were ~72 posts in the Jewspaper's thread at that time. Since then
a new one has appeared but for mine to show up there I'm still waiting:
(As submitted)
A normal alias "gentile" reader hesitates to send a comment to a venue
which brazenly disregards its own posted rules of censorship. So I
hesitated but what's a few minutes and besides I can always copy the
remark & post it elsewhere, right?
The noble Israeli army captain, now major, risked his life on the
battlefield to take a strange girl some candy. Later she was found
dead, probably murdered by her mother in a typical Arab PR move. The
judges of the military court proved their integrity in resisting the
howls of the ignorant lynch mob.
In this thread numerous patriotic Jews from various locations have
stepped forward to salute this modest, iconic Israeli combatant.
The reader can now put back the batteries into her Irony Detector. Who
can say for sure what tomorrow will bring?
Yet each of us, for sure, can say what she desires from Heaven. As for
me, with all my strength I call on the law-enforcing Six Billion of
Earth utterly to destroy all murderers & their wicked works.
(End of submission)
======================================================
1.) Case of the Murder Of Iman al-Hams
w w w . h a a r e t z . c o m
Last update - 18:45 22/03/2006
IDF officer cleared in death of Gaza girl to receive compensation from
state
By Amos Harel, Haaretz correspondent
A Givati Brigade officer will receive NIS 80,000 in compensation from
the state after he was cleared of all charges in relating to the death
of 13-year-old Palestinian girl, Iman Al Hamas, in the much-publicized
"confirmed kill" affair.
Captain "R" will receive NIS 80,000 in compensation from the state in
addition to reimbursement for NIS 2,000 of legal expenses, as part of
an arrangement reached between his lawyers and the military
prosecution.
The agreement was made official Wednesday in the Israel Defense
Forces's Southern Command court.
The officer, who at the time of the incident was serving as a company
commander in the Givati infantry brigade's Shaked battalion, has since
been promoted to major, and is currently serving as an operations
officer in the brigade.
The judges who acquitted Captain R accepted his version of event, in
which he stated that the shots that he fired were not aimed directly at
the girl's body. Captain R told the court he opened fire in order to
create a deterrence, and that he believed that the young girl posed a
serious threat.
The judges also criticized the Military Police's investigation of the
case, which was based upon a poor transcription of recorded evidence
and upon the testimonies of disgruntled soldiers serving under Captain
R.
==============================================
{The dozen comments below are my numbering & selection for their
pathological interest.
There were also some honorable exceptions, notably those of Gad Gilidi
of Brussels, of Yaakov Sullivan of NY and of Steve Beikirch of Iola,
Texas (which is hard to find on the map)--HW.}
RESPONSE #1.)
Amos Harel, Haaretz correspondent: IDF officer cleared in death of Gaza
girl to receive compensation from state
Talkback
Title: One of our finest Jew.
Name: Rabbi Benyamin Gold
City: Jerusalem State: Israel
He should get his long overdue medal. He is the salt of the earth and a
true Israeli. G-d bless you Captain/Major "R".
R #2.)
Amos Harel, Haaretz correspondent: IDF officer cleared in death of Gaza
girl to receive compensation from state
Talkback
Title: To all those angry Israel bashers
Name: Allon
City: London State:
You all seem quite sure that he is a murderer and that he was aiming at
her, and that she was hit I don`t know how many times... Sorry, but how
many of you were there? You`re all a load of haters, not just of
Israel, jews.. but of everything. I`d like to give my condolences to
the family of the girl... for all it`s worth, whilst I wasn`t there at
the time, I don`t think a 13 YO girl was a threat. But why do you all
have to send your dirty little hate-letters, you have nothing positive
to say about anything. Just hate Israel, hate Jew... Terrible that such
a young girl should die in this way, but how do you know what happened.
No, you are the shameful ones.
R #3.)
Title: make a mitzva!
Name: muhamad al-sharmoota
City: State:
thanks to people like captain R we have our precious land of israel in
our hands, thanks to those brave and courageous men who defend eretz
israel we can live in our land
the arab , no matter what age , are tought to kill and die killing, if
the little arab girl had killed soldiers you all arabs, arab supporters
and so on would be celebrating now, but the reality is that mess with
the best die like the rest!
kol ha`kavod lecha captain R
R #4.)
Title: Obviously people don`t care about justice
Name: Ilan Toren
City: Ariel State:
If the issue were justice then the compensation after being put
through hell for his alleged, and subsequently proven false, charges
would be obvious. Rather they are offended that one of their blood
libels failed. Work yourselves into a fit guys, you deserve it!
R #5.)
Title: STOP Whining...All of you
Name: Yoni
City: Montreal State: Canada
Why are you all so critical of this man doing his job. How often are
all of you online criticizing the arabs when a homicide bomber murders
dozens of people in one shot.
Now I don`t know about you, but if I were to hear gunfire - I wouldn`t
be roaming around outside.
Finally why are you so upset - she is now a martyr. Her mother will be
dancing in the street, handing out candies, and she will go straight to
heaven.
Captain R, KEEP DEFENDING ERETZ ISRAEL!!!
Kids all ALWAYS used as shields and sh
R #6.)
Title: #5 -Reality Check`s reality check
Name: Paul
City: Tel Aviv State:
that`s the problem Reality Check; you`re claiming to have seen
something that you obviously didn`t. When terrorist stop using little
children as pawns in their sick and murderous games, incidents like
this will cease.
R # 7.)
Title: child-killer
Name: jeremy fish
City: tel-aviv State:
I`m amazed by the sheer hate of Israel-haters on this forum, and
especially Gad Giladi who served in IDF, he should know that IDF has a
strict code of conduct and rules of engagement. There`re plenty of
cases when the army refrains from engagement in ordere not to harm Arab
civilians behind whole backs terrorists operate.
Most importantly - the officer was found not guilty by Israeli court of
justice.Israel judicial system with all its flaws is quite independent
and professional, obviously they had a good reason to find him not
guilty. Or do you Israel-haters know something that we don`t? And when
do we hear your voices when the Palestinian thugs kill whole families
in cold at blank range?Where is your righteous anger then?Or did you
ever hear of a Palestinian court that had found a Pal terrorist
guilty?Or I forgot - Pals obviously have a very unbiased and
professional judiciary...
Shame, shame , shame!
R #8.)
Title: How to foment anti-semitism
Name: Pete
City: State:
Beyond the obvious tragedy of this young girl being brutally murdered,
the flagrent exhonoration and rewarding of Captian R will foment
anti-semitism. Those out there who do undrestand the dynamics at play
here will wrongly vent their anger at JEWS rather than at ISRAELIS.
The argument of pervasive anti-semitism is not true at the moment, but
if Israel continues on this course, it will become a reality. It is a
self-fulfilling prophesy.
R #9.)
Title: To Seawife: can none of you read?
Name: Ora
City: State: Israel
"You mean he didn`t kill her like animal? Or he didn`t empty his
revolver into her head as she was trashing on the floor like an
animal?"
No. No he didn`t. That was, in fact, the entire point of the article.
The other soldiers in his unit lied to get him in trouble, and later
recanted their testimony and admitted that he had in fact fired only in
an attempt to scare the girl away. He did not fire at her as she was
dying. Apparently several dozen posters managed to miss that. Note to
anti-Israeli morons: next time read the article before you start
flailing angrily about on the forums, ok?
R #10.)
Title: dutch, a failed terror apologist
Name: jeremy
City: State:
a failed society? i beg to differ. Israel remains a beacon of light in
a dark murky world. surrounded by evil backwards tyrants, they have
remained democratic. continuing to give arabs more rights then they
would enjoy in any muslim country.
we all know you are nothing more then a hamas mouthpiece dutch. your
words are no more convincing then the average indoctrinated terror
apologist.
R #11.)
Title: Soldier should be praised
Name: it`s logic
City: State:
Rabbi Gold: Major R is a Bedouin, he is not Jewish. But it doesn`t
matter, he`s a loyal soldier and citizen of Israel. He`s done much more
for the security of Israeli civilians than any of these Arab Israelis,
or "Palestinians of 48" as they like to call themselves, who only know
how to take advantage of the State`s welfare and social institutions
while at the same time outright refuse to recognize the State of
Israel.
Having said that, I see nothing wrong with that this commander did. He
clearly interpreted the victim, who turned out to be a young girl, as a
threat who refused to leave the area after it was asked to do so
repeatedly, an area that is a hotbed of Arab terrorists.
The army, in response to international pressure, was looking for a
scapegoat. Luckily it was proved that the case against the commander
was tailored and based on hearsay, including the testimonies of a few
Jewish soldiers who didn`t exactly like the fact that they were being
commanded by Bedouin.
R #12.)
Title: Gad
Name: Connie
City: State:
You are in the right place, Belgium, land of the looney leftists. Did
it ever occur to you to believe this soldier? Did it ever occur to you
that you may be an embarrassement to all Israeli`s. My husband fought
in 2 wars in Israel...Thank-God he is proud of the IDF and isn`t a lily
weak fool like you.Do you ever cry for your dead Jewish brothers and
sisters or are you to busy protecting the Palestinians.?
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
& the odd snippet:
Confronting Islam, in fact, is precisely the perspective put forward in
the new the Quadrennial Defense Review--the Pentagon's strategic
document that comes out for a "long war" against terrorism.
"The enemies in this war are not traditional conventional military
forces, but rather dispersed, global terrorist networks that exploit
Islam to advance radical political aims," the document declares. "These
enemies have the avowed aim of acquiring and using nuclear and
biological weapons to murder hundreds of thousands of Americans and
others around the world...Currently, Iraq and Afghanistan are crucial
battlegrounds, but the struggle extends far beyond their borders. With
its allies and partners, the United States must be prepared to wage
this war in many locations simultaneously, and for some years to come."
Weekend Edition
February 25 / 26, 2006
"Global War ... For Some Years to Come."
Target: Iran
By LEE SUSTAR
==============================================================================
TOPIC: More than 100 suspected illegal immigrants found in 8 traffic incidents
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/7338c9a79b60b67e
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 9:36 pm
From: "gpsman"
bernard farquart wrote:
> "gpsman" <gpsman@driversmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1143053046.271272.250900@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
> > Frank Arthur wrote: <brevity snip>
> >
> >> "laura bush" states that "ALL illegals are dangerous drivers". This is a
> >> clearly insane statement.
> >
> > I think snipping "these", from the original post of "ALL _these_
> > illegals", and then claiming the OP is insane for saying something they
> > actually didn't... indicates insanity.
> > -----
> >
> > - gpsman
> >
> Holy crap, I agree with a gpsman post.
-----
<blush> I wouldn't say that too loud, you might get plonked.
I can't always be wrong. Gimme another chance...
-----
- gpsman
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Afghan Man Sentenced to Death for Converting
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/bd295e44b8e99935
==============================================================================
== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:37 pm
From: "Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply>
<ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1143086271.565800.140720@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Seeker wrote:
>> "Mohd Kaffir" <fragrance28_693@hotmail.com> wrote ...
>
>> > The law of farud prevention had no relation to "castes".
>>
>> Of course it does. The one who were converting were the lower castes (sc,
>> tribals etc). These conversions were viewed as fraud by the largest
>> democracy. Meaning, lower castes are stupid and incapable of seeing the
>> fraud; therefore, a law was passed to tell the lower castes that they
>> don't
>> have the right to convert because all such conversions are fraud and the
>> lower castes are incapable and lacking mental faculty to see it.
>
> The law does not tell lower castes anything. It only tells
> proselytizers something.
The proselytizers are converting the lower castes. If India viewed lower
castes as capable of intelligence, why would they pass a law like this.
>
>> Right to practice religion freely is so fundamental, yet the worlds
>> largest
>> democracy can't seem to provide this right to its lower castes.
>
> The primary ones it can't seem to provide this freedom to is its
> Muslims. Can you find any instances of speeches to Muslims telling them
> of their right to take up kufr and invite other Muslims to kufr and
> shirk?
Speeches by Muslims will prove that the law can't provide them freedom? What
kind of an argument is that?
>
>> >> >> > Harami Hindu, you have such laws in India too where pain of death
>> >> >> > is
>> >> >> >>> imposed on anyone converting out of Hinduism.
>> > I am still waiting for proof on your above statement.
>> > Put up or shut the fuck up.
>> I provided you with the law in Tamil Nadu that makes it illegal for
>> anyone
>> to convert out of Hinduism.
>
> The law you quoted does not even mention Hinduism.
Even it doesn't mention, Hinduism, it was widely understood that it was to
prevent Hindus from converting to some other religion.
== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:41 pm
From: "Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply>
"Mark Donovan" <mdon@don.org> wrote in message
news:%NoUf.10235$TK2.3843@trnddc07...
> <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1143083888.816250.309570@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>> Seeker wrote:
>>> <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote ...
>
> I thought that's what we've been struggling to establish in that region:
> an extreme islamic fundamentalism. Isn't it true? No? Why? What are we
> trying to establish there?
Afghanistan was far more "extreme islamic fundamentalism" than today. Iraq
is far more "extreme islamic fundamentalism" today than before.
>
> Mark
>
>
>>> >> On 5 October 2002, the state government of Tamil Nadu, India, issued
>>> >> an
>>> >> ordinance that effectively (when interpreted according to Hindutva
>>> >> ideology) outlawed religious conversion.
>>> >> http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/10497.htm
>>> >
>>> > In the Tamilnadu law (repealed in 2004), a proselytizer was required
>>> > to
>>> > inform officials of the local district about the conversion; he did
>>> > not
>>> > require any permission to perform conversion ceremonies. It was up to
>>> > officials to take him to court with a charge of converting by force*,
>>> > allurement* or fraud* and it was upto a judge (not Hindutva
>>> > ideologists) to determine whether the charge had merit.
>>>
>>> The judges are Hindutaa ideologues.
>>
>> Do you have a survey?
>>
>>> The political climate in Tamil Nadu is
>>> Hindutva.
>>
>> Ho ho!
>>
>>> > himself, there was a penalty only for converting other people (and
>>> > only
>>> > if converted by force, allurement or fraud), and the penalty was
>>> > certainly not death; it was (a maximum of) a fine and imprisonment.
>>>
>>> Why is this even needed. If someone converts a Hindu by fraud, you can
>>> convert that person back to Hinduism by fraud.
>>
>> I haven't said it is needed; I have only said that the law you refer to
>> doesn't say "do not proselytize or convert" but rather says, "it's
>> illegal to convert by force, bribery or fraud". Be that as it may,
>> changing the question to: why is this deemed neecessary even by some
>> people who support the right to convert and proselytize, the
>> paradoxical answer is that there are schools of thought that some kinds
>> of proselytism infringe on religious liberty.
>>
>> An example of a discussion of the subject outside India:
>> http://www.libertymagazine.org/article/articleview/190/1/37/
>> experts were invited by the International Religious Liberty Association
>> (IRLA) and the Ministry of Justice of Spain to a May 1999 meeting in
>> Madrid. A consensus statement describes "bad" proselytism as an
>> unethical activity that can take many forms, including willful
>> misrepresentation of the beliefs and practices of others, or the use of
>> force, coercion, compulsion, mockery, or intimidation to press for
>> conversion
>>
>> As for why it is deemeed necessary by people who oppose the right to
>> convert and proselytize, if they can't get approval for laws to ban
>> proselytism, the next best thing they can aim for is laws to regulate
>> proselytism, and to then look for ways to find proselytizers in
>> violation of the regulations.
>>
>>> > * Definitions: (a) "allurement" means offer of any temptation in the
>>> > form of - (i) - any gift or gratification, either in cash or kind;
>>> > (ii)
>>> > - grant of any material benefit, either monetary or otherwise. (b)
>>> > "convert" means to make one person to renounce one religion and adopt
>>> > another religion; (c) "force" includes a show of force or threat of
>>> > injury of any kind including threat of divine displeasure or social
>>> > ex-communication; (d) "fraudulent means" includes misrepresentation or
>>> > any other fraudulent contrivance.
>>
>
>
== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:48 pm
From: "Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply>
<ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1142909516.118336.311100@z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Seeker wrote:
>> <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
>> No, the thread is about the law itself, not the penalty.
>
> The penalty is prominently mentioned in the title. So, stop
> bullshitting that it's not about the penalty.
Calm down. If you take that line of argument than, this thread is only about
one case, but the arguments brought forth was about the "principle" of such
penalty. I.e. the law.
>
>> > There hasn't been a law in Tamilnadu to deal with apostacy (a situation
>> > of someone who leaves a religion or converts himself to another
>> > religion).
>>
>> The Afghan didn't convert himself either. He was converted.
>
> We don't know that. Be that as it may, in the Tamilnadu law, there is
> no penalty for the convert. Under that law, proselytization too is
> legal; only certain methods of proselytization are illegal. One of
> those methods, conversion by force, is illegal everywhere else in the
What the heck is conversion by force? How can you force anyone to convert.
If it was that easy, then why didn't Taimur convert entire population of
India.
> free world. As for the other methods - allurement (such as handing out
> $100 bills to tramps willing to be baptized into Mormonism), such
I have never heard of Mormons every doing this.
> methods are not looked upon with favor even elsewhere in the free
> world.
Do they legislate laws against it? Only India has that distinction and seems
now the Indian backed NA government in Afghanistan is following suit.
>
>> > No court in the Republic of India has passed a sentence of killling a
>> > Dalit and burning his village. In Afghanistan, it appears that a court
>> > may pass a death sentence for apostacy.
>>
>> That is a minor detail. Whether a court imposes the pain of death on
>> someone
>> for conversion or a mob lynches someone for conversion, the end result is
>> the same -- a person dead.
>
> The discussion is about the law, so it is not a minor detail.
First you said it was about the penalty???? Regardless, is the principle
between the Afghanistan law and Tamilnadu law different?
>
> http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2006/03/executing_chris.html
> Sir Charles James Napier got it right. Napier was the British
> commander-in-chief in India, and he prohibited burning widows alive on
> the funeral pyres of their husbands. When some Hindu leaders objected,
> Napier is said to have replied, "You say that it is your custom to burn
> widows. Very well. We too have a custom: when men burn a woman alive,
> we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral
> pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow
> your custom. And then we will follow ours."
Napier denied the religious freedom to Hindus that Muslim rulers had allowed
for over a thousand years. What is your point?
== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:52 pm
From: "Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply>
<ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1142910289.033499.204170@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com...
> Seeker wrote:
>> > Proselytization is a person seeking to convert other people.
>>
>> Whether the law seeks to punish the "convertor" or the "convertee" the
>> message is the same: don't convert.
>
> Was Pope John Paul II's message "don't convert others" in his piece on
> "Dignitatis Humanae":
I didn't know the Pope's word is the law in any country? with the possible
exception of the Vatican. Pope is providing a message that is most likely
designed to not damage the image of the Catholic Church too much. Doesn't
mean that countries of the world should legislate laws on this principle
preventing people from choosing a religion.
> http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2004/04/proselytization.html
> Religious communities also have the right not to be hindered in their
> public teaching and witness to their faith, whether by the spoken or by
> the written word. However, in spreading religious faith and in
> introducing religious practices everyone ought at all times to refrain
> from any manner of action which might seem to carry a hint of coercion
> or of a kind of persuasion that would be dishonorable or unworthy,
> especially when dealing with poor or uneducated people. Such a manner
> of action would have to be considered an abuse of one's right and a
> violation of the right of others.
>
== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:58 pm
From: "Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply>
<gunjan.ghai@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1142854898.024497.238500@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Seeker
>
> Not every religion and country thinks like Islam/Pakistan....I know its
> tough for you to imagine a country like that but wake up
Hahahaha. This is funny. How do you know all of this?
>
> Firstly....the conversions intended to be banned were related to giving
> financial means to poor people in lieu of conversions....no Dalit as
> far as I can remember was killed for conversions....there were
> backlashes against people trying to convert tribals etc....but not the
> Dalits....they are considered Hindus by those who are opposed to
> conversions. Infact a so called 'Shuddhi' movement started in the
> tribal areas to reconvert tribals back to HInduism - with due respect
> to them
'Shuddhi' movement started long before that.
>
> And you are justifying laws in Afghanistan by saying that this man
> broke the afghani law...the question is....can this be called a law or
> is it the islamists trying to hold on to their decaying religion by
> killing human freedom
If a man is sentenced to death, doesn't that mean that a law was violated?
Besides, quit putting words in my mouth. I never justified the law. The only
principle I justified was that a well-known law existed in Afghanistan and
it was violated knowingly. The violator knew of the risks before hand and
hence is now subject to punishment. You can't fault Afghanistan on that
basis. The convert could have gone elsewhere and converted, he could have
maintained discretion about his conversion, or he could have chosen not to
violate the law.
>
> And as far as freedom goes in Pakistan...we all know what the MQM
> leader has said about Pakistani Muslims vs Indian Muslims.....read your
> stuff before you talk
We are not talking about Pakistan here. Are we? Why does your Indian
education system lead you to connect Pakistan with everything? Could it be
that Pakistan rules your hearts, minds and souls?
== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:07 pm
From: "ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com"
Seeker wrote:
> <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote ...
> > Seeker wrote:
> >> "Mohd Kaffir" <fragrance28_693@hotmail.com> wrote ...
> >
> >> > The law of farud prevention had no relation to "castes".
> >>
> >> Of course it does. The one who were converting were the lower castes (sc,
> >> tribals etc). These conversions were viewed as fraud by the largest
> >> democracy. Meaning, lower castes are stupid and incapable of seeing the
> >> fraud; therefore, a law was passed to tell the lower castes that they
> >> don't
> >> have the right to convert because all such conversions are fraud and the
> >> lower castes are incapable and lacking mental faculty to see it.
> >
> > The law does not tell lower castes anything. It only tells
> > proselytizers something.
>
> The proselytizers are converting the lower castes. If India viewed lower
> castes as capable of intelligence, why would they pass a law like this.
India hasn't. Only some states have, and no state has passed a law
saying that ALL conversions are fraud.
> >> Right to practice religion freely is so fundamental, yet the worlds
> >> largest
> >> democracy can't seem to provide this right to its lower castes.
> >
> > The primary ones it can't seem to provide this freedom to is its
> > Muslims. Can you find any instances of speeches to Muslims telling them
> > of their right to take up kufr and invite other Muslims to kufr and
> > shirk?
>
> Speeches by Muslims will prove that the law can't provide them freedom? What
> kind of an argument is that?
Such speeches by secularists or state officials is what is lacking.
> >> >> >> > Harami Hindu, you have such laws in India too where pain of death
> >> >> >> > is
> >> >> >> >>> imposed on anyone converting out of Hinduism.
> >> > I am still waiting for proof on your above statement.
> >> > Put up or shut the fuck up.
> >> I provided you with the law in Tamil Nadu that makes it illegal for
> >> anyone to convert out of Hinduism.
> >
> > The law you quoted does not even mention Hinduism.
>
> Even it doesn't mention, Hinduism, it was widely understood that it was to
> prevent Hindus from converting to some other religion.
A law can't make it illegal to convert out of Hinduism unless it
mentions Hinduism.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Dine and Dance at Karachi University
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/612b78692fd8323c
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 9:37 pm
From: "Mirza Ghalib"
Truly a (third) world class university
====================================
KU ISSUES
Letter in Dawn, Mar 23
KARACHI University's cafeteria is in an awful condition. Dirty cats
roam inside, trash is strewn over the floor, broken seats, dirty dining
tables and just one big over-stuffed trash bin. There is one old man
running around and cleaning up, while the young students are busy
feasting and throwing rubbish everywhere.
The university administration claims that repair work is in progress on
new toilets, new sewerage lines and botanical gardens but they are
ignorant about the lack of cleanliness in the cafeteria.
TASNEEM ZAFAR FARIDI
Karachi
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Cuban Conference Focuses on Elder Care
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3a7ce9372ec23e22
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 9:54 pm
From: Bob
Leo J Callaghan wrote:
> On 22 Mar 2006 13:52:52 -0800, "Archie" <akenn100@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> A long time ago Castro said, "History will absolve us".
>
> bad translation; fidel said bury. communism has been buried elsewhere.
> fidel and his sub-human blood suckers are the living dead.
In Latin America, Communism is victorious! Cuba has one of the lowest
rates of malnutrition in the Hemisphere, has the lowest infant mortality
and the longest life expectancy. They have more doctors per capita than
any nation on Earth. They are one of the best-fed populations in the
Americas.
All Cubans have a job; there is no unemployment, and if there is, they
get a check. There is housing for all Cubans - no homeless, no cardboard
shacks. Cuba has the best health care system and the best educational
system in the Americas. Almost all Cubans have plumbing, electricity,
clean water, transportation and access to cultural events. Cuba feeds
every one of its citizens. What has failed the Americas is capitalism.
East Bloc Communism was competing with West European social democracy
(socialism) and social democracy (socialism) beat Communism over there.
But there is no real social democracy (socialism) in the Americas -
there is only a malignant and deformed oligarchic semi-feudalism posing
as capitalism. As long as capitalism continues to fail the Americas,
Cuban Communism will continue to kick ass in Latin America.
>
> and ahh, archee, history doesn't do anything. it is made up by the
> winners. and your gang are the losers.
>
> so for one point, if communism is so swell how cum you lost the cold
> war?
See above. Socialism beat Communism is Europe and Eurasia. So what?
Isn't it interesting how socialist China, with its exploding economy, is
taking the world by storm?
or are you 16 yrs old and don't have any knowledge (or interest
> or ability) to know what happened before you were born?
>
> give it up. communism lost the cold war. full stop. you are dead
> archee, lie down and stop stinkin' up the place with dead commie
> stink. it may be ok in your trailer but out here, amongst the humans,
> not so good.
In Latin America, Cuban Communism is kicking ass on backwards oligarchic
capitalism.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Is the US getting it's ass kicked again?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/c3e720f581a7b047
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Mar 23 2006 5:57 am
From: "Titix"
Really? If you see the casualty list you will notice it is 10 to 1 or even
greater.
I won't consider that getting our asses kicked, on the contrary. But if it
makes
you feel good thinking that way...go ahead have fun with yourself.
"HelpmaBoab" <FU2@yahoo.co.zpc> wrote in message
news:bhoUf.8054$JZ1.288956@news.xtra.co.nz...
> Will they never learn. The Yanks got their asses kicked in Vietnam and now
> it is happening again in Iraq - even Afghanistan. Innocent Yanks suffer
> while the chimp in the whitehouse stays in power.
>
>
> Tam
>
>
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Castro is to the Cuban people what Hitler is to the Jews
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/8ece78896aa2d7af
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 10:11 pm
From: "Miguel"
periodistalibre@aol.com wrote:
> Anti-Empire Notes: The Cuban Punching Bag
>
> By WILLIAM BLUM --- an apologist of a tyrant
William Blum has published many books and articles always critical of
the US, the land he was born.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-url/index=stripbooks&field-keywords=william%20blum&results-process=default&dispatch=search/ref=pd_sl_aw_tops-1_stripbooks_4360270_2/102-3675220-8388938
But, he does not want the Cuban people to enjoy the freedoms he enjoys
in this country.
How would he feel if, all of a sudden, he would be labeled an enemy of
this country because he is supportive of Castro's dictatorship, a
country that is labeled by the US State Department a state that
sponsors terrorism? What if he would be thrown in a dungeon for 25
years? What if he could not publish his books in this country?
In this article, he does not mention that these 75 Cuban men and women
were condemned to 20, 25 years in jail for writing articles against the
regime. To Castro and to his agents, that means being a puppet of the
US. It means it is all right to thrown them 25 years in jail.
> The Committee to Protect Journalists, located in New York, calls itself
> "An Independent, nonprofit organization dedicated to defending press
> freedom worldwide". In December it issued a report that said that
> "China, Cuba, Eritrea, and Ethiopia are the world's leading jailers of
> journalists in 2005".
This is the truth.
>
> On January 7 I sent them the following email:
>
> "Dear People,
>
> "I have a question concerning your report on imprisoned journalists.
> You write that you consider journalists imprisoned when governments
> deprive them of their liberty because of their work. This implies that
> they've been imprisoned because of WHAT THEY'VE WRITTEN PER SE. You
> show Cuba with 24. And I would question whether your criterion applies
> to the Cuban cases. The arrests of these persons in Cuba had nothing to
> do with them being journalists, or even being dissidents, per se, but
> had everything to do with their very close, indeed intimate, political
> and financial connections to American government officials.
Lies Lies and more Lies. These Cubans are patriots that are unjustly
condemned by a totalitarian regime. Is that what Mr. Blum wants for
this great nation?
>
> "The United States is to the Cuban government like al Qaeda is to
> Washington, only much more powerful and much closer. During the period
> of the Cuban revolution, the United States and anti-Castro Cuban exiles
> in the US have inflicted upon Cuba damage greater than what happened in
> New York and Washington on September 11, 2001. In 1999, Cuba filed a
> suit against the United States for $181.1 billion in compensation for
> victims of (at that time) forty years of aggression. The suit accused
> Washington policies of being responsible for the death of 3,478 Cubans
> and wounding or disabling 2,099 others.
Fidel Castro is responsible for the death of thousands of Cubans
http://members.aol.com/aguadacuba/cs/menu.htm
(there is a section in English)
>
> "Would the US ignore a group of Americans receiving funds from al Qaeda
> and engaging in repeated meetings with known leaders of that
> organization inside the United States? Would it matter if these
> American dissidents claimed to be journalists? In the past few years,
> the American government has arrested a great many people in the US and
> abroad on the basis of alleged ties to al Qaeda, with a lot less
> evidence to go by than Cuba had with its dissidents' ties to the United
> States.
These Cubans HAVE NEVER COMMITTED ANY TERRORISTS ACTS. They are in jail
because they have openly opposed the Castro regime.What funds did they
receive? A computer? Paper? These people were thrown from their jobs
for their views.They have gone through hell because they believe in
freedom and democracy.
>
> "Moreover, most of the arrested Cubans can hardly be called
> journalists. Their only published works have appeared on websites
> maintained by agencies of the United States."
Communist propaganda. They are not allowed to write in their country
because Cuba is a totalitarian state.
>
> On February 10, having received no reply, I sent another email
> referring them to my January 7 letter. As of March 21 I still have not
> received a reply. In the United States one does not have to defend
> attacking Cuba for any reason. You just do it, and if by some oddball
> chance, some oddball person asks you to defend what you've said ... Who
> cares? The sports section of the Washington Post today brings another
> mindless knee-reflex attack. Alfonso Soriano, the Washington National's
> new player, has refused to play left field, insisting on his regular
> second-base position. "Imagine," writes Thomas Boswell, "Soriano
> refusing to change positions if he played for the Cuban team in the WBC
> title game. Fidel Castro might have disposed of the body before game
> time."
So what?
>
> Incidentally, it might also be noted that amongst America's prison
> population of more than two million, there are probably at least a few
> hundred who have practiced journalism at one time or other, in one
> manner or other.
The 2 million Americans in jail are not there for expressing their
political views. Had it been the case, Mr Blum would have been there
with them, instead of making a lot of money by villanizing the country
that gives him the opportunity to openly express his anti-government
views.
He also fails to mention that Cuba, a country of 11 million, has more
than 250 thousand Cubans in prison. In Cuba if you are caught selling
anything in the black market you can spend 3 to 4 years in jail. If you
say something irreverent against Castro you can be prosecuted under the
law of "desacato" and spend as many years in jail as they wish.
>
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> William Blum is the author of Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA
> Interventions Since World War II, Rogue State: a guide to the World's
> Only Super Power. and West-Bloc Dissident: a Cold War Political Memoir.
==============================================================================
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "soc.culture.usa"
group.
To post to this group, send email to soc.culture.usa@googlegroups.com or visit
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to soc.culture.usa-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
To change the way you get mail from this group, visit:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/subscribe
To report abuse, send email explaining the problem to abuse@googlegroups.com
==============================================================================
Google Groups: http://groups.google.com
