soc.culture.usa
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa
soc.culture.usa@googlegroups.com
Today's topics:
* TURKS DISCOVERED AMERICA LONG BEFORE Kurds walked on 2 legs - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/5c9c10fd0d5c020d
* CHINESE TOLD BUSH GO FUCK HIS MOTHER!!! - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a1294ee1a5c92a08
* N.Korea: Pre-emptive Attacks Can Go Both Ways - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/51baedf3751506b1
* Who would win an all-out fight between Christianity and Islam? - 1 messages,
1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/33dae19b5b171eb4
* What's Israel done for America, lately... ever? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/67529f7111b6b0a2
* ? When Did The World Learn About The Holocaust ? - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/c33218197a5bac0d
* ETHANOL: HOW BRAZIL BEATS THE U.S. - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3d538d9c70b9eeaf
* Pakistan: Terror Workshop of the World - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/91c948fc45a53c60
* Talmudistan's Rabbi Calls For Murder of Uri Avnery By IDF Terrorist Forces -
3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/bd8d5b775eee212e
* The Islamization of America - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e09bb80be0ac7edb
* Truth offends Arabs - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3eb82bdf273c49c9
* Government To Prosecute Communist Crimes - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/d44005fcb74047d9
* THE ULTIMATE BATTLE: MAN VS. DEVILS - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/42e17afd29f1834a
* gun owners and nra proven wrong - again - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/113cc170f0e4312a
* ANOTHER US war Crime.. In cold blood... - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/2f8fc6c826a82cba
* When Moslems turn crazy - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/f67c93c500c4800a
* Gay Jews are thriving in New York City - 2 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e37b06ddfaeb8960
* Salah Jafar projecting his latent Homosexuality again? - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3a3e2a77a85b1e49
* Mr. Bush Says Troops to Stay in Iraq Through His Presidency. Why? - 1
messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a324bc7e5701fadf
* THE SKY IS WEEPING FOR THE FIRST AMENDMENT - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/baf027c3f635c5c0
==============================================================================
TOPIC: TURKS DISCOVERED AMERICA LONG BEFORE Kurds walked on 2 legs
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/5c9c10fd0d5c020d
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:51 am
From: Panta Rhei
Seanie & His Grik loving Chauffeurs writes:
> Your days in Belfast are NUMBERED my BOGUS asylum seeking chum
>
Aww! Are they, Weenie Beanie? Did you count them yet? LMAO! Poor, helpless,
blathering idiot! <BG>
--
If stupidity had financial value you'd be stinking rich, Seanie.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: CHINESE TOLD BUSH GO FUCK HIS MOTHER!!!
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a1294ee1a5c92a08
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 4:54 pm
From: "Komin"
Bush is doing what the Chinese wishes he [ Bush ] would do, that is
for the US military to stay in Iraq for long -term , just like the
US military did during the Vietnam war .
==============================================================================
TOPIC: N.Korea: Pre-emptive Attacks Can Go Both Ways
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/51baedf3751506b1
==============================================================================
== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 4:55 pm
From: Nick James
On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 16:48:28 -0800, Peter Franks <none@none.com> wrote:
>Do you know what the optimal elevation for the detonation of a nuclear
>device is?
Optimal???
LOL!
Who cares.
I'm still going to enjoy watching it in High Def.
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:04 am
From: "Morton Davis"
"Peter Franks" <none@none.com> wrote in message
news:271Uf.16$Fl.4@fed1read09...
> Nick James wrote:
> > On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 16:12:14 -0800, Peter Franks <none@none.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Nick James wrote:
> >>
> >>>On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 14:33:02 -0800, Peter Franks <none@none.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Nick James wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>Considering two nuked US cities would bring the country completely
down.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>How *** are they going to get here?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Freight container. They may already be in the country.
> >>>>
> >>>>Do you have any references on the effects of a ground-based explosion?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>Two nuked US cities wouldn't bring
> >>>>>>America down,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I believe it would. Like a hole in a balloon.
> >>>>
> >>>>Doubtful -- it would definitely be demoralizing. From an
infrastructure
> >>>>perspective, it probably wouldn't have much direct impact on the
economy
> >>>>or market, there are enough alternatives to any thing that would be
> >>>>damaged/destroyed.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Who would rebuild it?
> >>>You can't afford Halliburton prices.
> >>>Look at New Orleans.
> >>
> >>I reiterate, go and research the topic of at-ground-level explosions.
> >>
> >
> > Have you heard of airplanes?
>
> Right, airplanes...
>
> Do you know what the optimal elevation for the detonation of a nuclear
> device is? Hint: it isn't ground level and it isn't cruising altitude.
>
> Oh, but wait -- how is the nuclear device even loaded on the airplane?
> It came over in a shipping container, so how much does your hypothetical
> device weigh? What kind of aircraft is it loaded on to? Commercial,
> private, ???
>
> But I guess that is just "technical crap"...
>
> > BTW you are talking out of your ass about the technical crap.
>
> ?!
>
> So far you have written a bunch of unsubstantiated garbage about a
> "nuking a city", and calling it a very real threat, but based on what???
> Your 80% estimate?!
>
> > The US still has no accurate intelligence on Russian battlefield nukes.
>
> Do you have that "accurate intelligence" you speak of? Can it be used
> to "nuke a city"?
>
> If you don't know, then how can you assume that it would be suitable to
> "nuke a city".
>
>
>
> > There are plenty of people who believe they could be detonated with the
push of
> > a button.
>
> Excellent! What relevance does that have in your conclusion that is
> completely full of holes and entirely unsubstantiated.
>
> What was the point of your original statements? To yell something over
> the fence and then run away? Or, are you interested in a careful
> discussion of the subject. If you are interested in a discussion,
> please come *PREPARED* to discuss the corroborative aspects of your
> statement.
The interesting thing about nuclear bombsis that a handful of people were in
a home within blocks of ground zero in Hiroshima and they survived the blast
100% unscathed. The interesting thing about Nick James' posts is that
there's nothing interesting about them at all. It's not even good trollage.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Who would win an all-out fight between Christianity and Islam?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/33dae19b5b171eb4
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:01 am
From: salad
Kevin wrote:
> OK, sports fans, lemme hear your take on an all-out Christian verses
> Islam battle. Winner take all. Who would win, and why?
>
Christians are the best potential killers in the world. They have
developed the finest bombs, chemical agents, biological agents, and all
of the other myriad ways of killing people. There is no doubt that if
Christians were to "unChristianize" themselves for a bit and go on a
rampage to kill mankind, they would succeed. Islam wouldn't stand a chance.
Randy Wayne White summed it up in the book "Dead Of Night" when he wrote
"In any conflict, the boundaries of behavior are defined by those who
value morality least." If Christians were to forsake morality, we would
define the war and depravity associated with it.
That is why we had a difficult time in Vietnam and why we are having
problems in Iraq. We haven't turned into the monsters that we are
required to be in order to "win". We could combine the worst traits of
Hitler, Pol Pot, and Attila the Hun, and other like minded people and we
could rain death on this world unlike anything ever seen. Convincing
the people in the US that those traits are necessary and desired is
difficult. Too many of us love life and have grown up in freedom. The
fringe Christians may yearn for Armageddon and Rapture but they are the
minority, fortunately.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: What's Israel done for America, lately... ever?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/67529f7111b6b0a2
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:05 am
From: Yosemite Sam
On 21 Mar 2006 14:42:45 -0800, "Honest Aryan" <ha@centralpets.com>
wrote:
>Yosemite Sam wrote:
>
>> racist.
>
> Hypocrite.
RACIST.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: ? When Did The World Learn About The Holocaust ?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/c33218197a5bac0d
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:06 am
From: Yosemite Sam
On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 18:23:30 -0500, Provocator <docl@imf.com> wrote:
>Yosemite Sam wrote:
>> On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 14:29:08 -0500, Provocator <docl@imf.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Holocauste is a MYTH!
>>
>>
>> ESAD
>
>DARE
KMA
==============================================================================
TOPIC: ETHANOL: HOW BRAZIL BEATS THE U.S.
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3d538d9c70b9eeaf
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:07 am
From: Dan Bloomquist
donquijote1954 wrote:
>
> I guess America is so involved in fighting terrorism that forgets to
> prepare herself for a fuel crisis, something Brazil has done...
> HOW BRAZIL BEATS THE U.S.
>
> Ethanol accounts for more than 40% of the
> fuel Brazilians use in their cars.
You are kidding?
Ethanol _gross_ production 2005 16billion liters/year.
equivalent to 150,000 bbl/d
Oil - Production (bbl/day): 1,788,000
According to
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2173rank.html
Oil - Consumption (bbl/day): 2,199,000
According to
http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2174rank.html
It doesn't even fill their import deficit. How much of that oil is used
to produce ethanol?
When someone says 'we can grow our way out of the oil problem', they
haven't done the math.
--
"We need an energy policy that encourages consumption"
George W. Bush.
"Conservation may be a sign of personal virtue, but it is not a
sufficient basis for a sound, comprehensive energy policy."
Vice President Dick Cheney
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Pakistan: Terror Workshop of the World
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/91c948fc45a53c60
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 7:08 pm
From: N A H
On 21 Mar 2006 16:26:32 -0800, "naureen101@aol.com" <naureen101@aol.com> wrote:
>Pakistan is the most progressive muslim country.
ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Talmudistan's Rabbi Calls For Murder of Uri Avnery By IDF Terrorist Forces
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/bd8d5b775eee212e
==============================================================================
== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:09 pm
From: "Deborah Sharavi"
> > > Theodore Herzl ("Thermidor Babblebore") wrote:
> > > > Burach Marzel, the Jewish equivalent of a mullah commonly known as a
> > > > rabbi, has called for the murder of those whose values and principals
> > > > differ from his and those of the ZioNazi agenda he represents.
> > docremington wrote:
> > > Of course, Thernodore, Marzel is not a rabbi, as well as a rabbi is not
> > > a mullah, why is that you must make stuff up?
Easy: because Thermidor doesn't know what he's talking about. The words
have differing Semitic roots:
docremington wrote:
> Of course, there is a big difference, Thermodore, comparing a rabbi
> with a mullah is fallacious.
Thermidor is too stupid to produce any lies that can't be easily
contradicted.
mul·lah
1. A male religious teacher or leader.
2. A form of address for such a man.
[Urdu mull, from Persian, from Arabic mawl, master, friend, from
waliya, to become near, be in charge; see wly in Semitic roots.
rab·bi
1. A person trained in Jewish law, ritual, and tradition and ordained
for leadership of a Jewish congregation, especially one serving as
chief religious official of a synagogue.
2. A scholar qualified to interpret Jewish law.
[Middle English rabi, from Old French, from Late Latin rabb, master,
from Greek rhabbi, O my master, from Hebrew and Aramaic rabbî, my
master : rab, master (from rab, to become great; see rbb in Semitic
roots) + -î, my.]
Additional difference: a mullah is always male. A rabbi can be male or
female.
> Theodore Herzl ("Thermidor Babblebore") wrote:
> > Rabbi, mullah, what's the difference, they are both radical religious
> > nutjobs who promote violence as a means to achieve their goals.
Another lie from Thermidor. The majority of rabbis are not "radical
religious nutjobs", nor do they "promote violence as a means to achieve
their goals".
And Chabad rabbis have just instructed their followers NOT to vote for
Marzel.
> > Burach Marzel is the leader of the Kach terrorist group
Wrong again. Marzel was spokesman for Kach., which he quit in 1994. He
is current heads Chazit. He has been arrested dozens of times since his
first conviction at age 17.
>>and once a
>> close associate of the murdering Jewish terrorist Rabbi Meir Kahane.
> Interesting. Who did he happen to murder, bth?
Kahane was murdered by an Islamic terrorist. Who, exactly, Kahane
murdered is something not even Thermidor can answer.
> > Call him a mullah or just a leader of a terrorist group Doc, he is
> > still scum that is no better than if his name was Osama Bin Marzel.
> I'm ready to dismiss it as a rather poor joke, Thermodore.
Thermidor has dozens of poor jokes, like his recent ones about Jews
starting WWII by declaring war on Germany, and Germany responding by
sending Jews to concentration camps, where there were no gas chambers,
and only a hundred thousand Jews died.
> > It is easy Doc, I disapprove of murder
Thermidor disapproves of murder only when the victims aren't Jews. When
Jews are murdered, Thermidor becomes deleriously happy, and wets his
pants from joy.
>>yet I am happy to see Sharon as
> > a drooling idiot while hoping he is suffering in pain at the same time.
> How can you, Thermodore, disapprove of murder and cheer palisimian
> gangsters?
Sense, you want, from a Jew hater like Thermidor? Do you expect the sun
will ever rise in the west, or Bush will stop lying?
> > > > Baruch Marzel: IDF must assassinate left-wing activist Uri Avnery
Arutz Sheva - 21:46 Mar 21, '06 / 21 Adar 5766
Chabad Rabbis Instruct Followers Not to Vote for Marzel
(IsraelNN.com) The Chabad Rabbinical Court came out against voting for
small parties in next week's election, fearing doing so would result
in "wasted votes".
Chabad rabbinical leaders took it a step further, instructing followers
not to vote for Baruch Marzel and his National Jewish Leadership Party.
> > > Avnery is, indeed, a major pest. What do you know,Themodore, he even
> > > called a palisimian human rights group "collaborators". What good can
> > > one expect coming from that ultraleftist crank? Besides, as coming from
> > > the rest of the article later, Avnery does not seem to mind, if those,
> > > who does not share his cranky ideas, are killed, does he? So, what is
> > > the problem?
> > One should not expect a ZioNazi like you to believe in free speech or
> > that you would support murder as a means to prevent free speech. Now
> > run along to your Kach meeting Doc.
> Is calling a palisimian rights group "collaborators" for their
> criticism of the palisimian corruption a free speech? It is more like
> an insulting free driveling.
> Besides, he really does not seem to mind, if his opponents get killed,
> the article itself suggests that. So, what's the matter?
> > You are free to have your own opinion of Avnery Doc, but if the
> > ZioNazis you support like Marzel got their way, Avnery would simply
> > have you killed for not agreeing with him as that is the ZioNazi way.
> It is the article, Thermodore, it is all in the article. While Avnery
> is, indeed, a major pest, are you suggesting that, he is a potential
> murderer too?
But of course Thermidor is -- or would, if he weren't so ignorant that
he didn't know Avnery used to be an Irgunist, and a follower of
Thermidor's real favorite "terrorist".
Deborah
== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:16 pm
From: "Sheldon Liberman"
Theodore Herzl wrote:
> docremington wrote:
> > Theodore Herzl wrote:
> > > Burach Marzel, the Jewish equivalent of a mullah commonly known as a
> > > rabbi, has called for the murder of those whose values and principals
> > > differ from his and those of the ZioNazi agenda he represents.
> > >
> >
> >
> > Of course, Thernodore, Marzel is not a rabbi, as well as a rabbi is not
> > a mullah, why is that you must make stuff up?
>
> Rabbi, mullah, what's the difference, they are both radical religious
> nutjobs who promote violence as a means to achieve their goals.
> Burach Marzel is the leader of the Kach terrorist group and once a
> close associate of the murdering Jewish terrorist Rabbi Meir Kahane.
> Call him a mullah or just a leader of a terrorist group Doc, he is
> still scum that is no better than if his name was Osama Bin Marzel.
>
> > > Previous calls by Jewish mullahs to kill PM's have resulted in the
> > > murder of Rabin and the vegetable state of Ariel "the Butcher" Sharon
> > > (may he soon rot in hell) whose doctors, through staged incompetence,
> > > caused the massive stroke that left Israel's leader a drooling wanted
> > > war criminal.
> >
> > I do not understand, Thermodore, how can you be happy and unhappy at
> > the same time?
>
> It is easy Doc, I disapprove of murder yet I am happy to see Sharon as
> a drooling idiot while hoping he is suffering in pain at the same time.
>
> > > Baruch Marzel: IDF must assassinate left-wing activist Uri Avnery
> >
> > Avnery is, indeed, a major pest. What do you know,Themodore, he even
> > called a palisimian human rights group "collaborators". What good can
> > one expect coming from that ultraleftist crank? Besides, as coming from
> > the rest of the article later, Avnery does not seem to mind, if those,
> > who does not share his cranky ideas, are killed, does he? So, what is
> > the problem?
>
> One should not expect a ZioNazi like you to believe in free speech or
> that you would support murder as a means to prevent free speech. Now
> run along to your Kach meeting Doc.
This from an islamofascist? Isn't it amazing how you can always be
relied upon to accuse others of that you are so extremely guilty of?
>
> > > http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/696472.html
> > > By Nadav Shragai, Haaretz Correspondent
> > > National Jewish Front leader Baruch Marzel, now campaigning for the
> > > March 28 Knesset election, said Monday the leaders of the Kadima party
> > > are "traitors" and "criminals" and called on the Israel Defense Forces
> > > to assassinate the far-left leader of the Gush Shalom movement Uri
> > > Avnery.
> > > Speaking Monday in Jerusalem and Ramle, Marzel said left-wing activists
> > > are bringing destruction upon themselves and said they sometimes harm
> > > the interests of Israel no less than do the country's external enemies.
> > > In response to comments by Avnery calling the 2001 assassination of
> > > cabinet minister Rehavam Ze'evi a Palestinian "targeted killing" - a
> > > term generally reserved for IDF strikes on terror leaders - Marzel said
> > > the IDF needs to target Avnery.
> >
> > So, it is a typical Haaretz trick of putting a cart before the horse.
> > Avnery burps garbage and gets shit in return, cause and effect, not
> > like in the Haaretz headline and an opening paragraph.
>
> You are free to have your own opinion of Avnery Doc, but if the
> ZioNazis you support like Marzel got their way, Avnery would simply
> have you killed for not agreeing with him as that is the ZioNazi way.
>
> > > Marzel also said, "Traitors sit in Kadima. They betrayed their own
> > > principles, Judaism and Zionism."
> > > On Monday evening, Peace Now called on Attorney General Menachem Mazuz
> > > to examine Marzel's statements for suspected illegal incitement.
> > > "Marzel forgot that he receives immunity only if and when he is voted
> > > into the Knesset - not before. Marzel is doing everything he can to
> > > make headlines and to shock people," Peace Now said.
> > > In addition to attacking his political opponents, Marzel also launched
> > > an offensive against Israel's legal system and system of rule.
> > > "Israel is ruled by the junta. In the army, in the courts and in
> > > government there joint thinking, joint voting and joint decision
> > > making," Marzel said. He said the state prosecution and the High Court
> > > of Justice make decisions that cause "Jewish bloodshed." He also said
> > > that "if polling stations were placed in the Supreme Court, it is
> > > reasonable to assume that a coalition of MK Ahmed Tibi and Meretz would
> > > win."
> > > The far-right extremist also expressed anger at attacks by National
> > > Union and the National Religious Party that he said increase the
> > > chances he won't obtain the minimum number of votes to allow him to
> > > enter the Knesset.
> > > Marzel maintained Tuesday that polls conducted on behalf of his party
> > > indicate the National Jewish Front would secure five seats in the
> > > coming election.
> > > Non-partisan polls predict Marzel's party won't receive any seats.
== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:18 pm
From: "Deborah Sharavi"
> Theodore Herzl ("Thermidor Babblebore") wrote:
> > One should not expect a ZioNazi like you to believe in free speech or
> > that you would support murder as a means to prevent free speech. Now
> > run along to your Kach meeting Doc.
Sheldon Liberman wrote:
> This from an islamofascist? Isn't it amazing how you can always be
> relied upon to accuse others of that you are so extremely guilty of?
Just more TPB, as Bill L would say.
Deborah
==============================================================================
TOPIC: The Islamization of America
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e09bb80be0ac7edb
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 8:10 pm
From: "serwad"
"DoD" <thecats@ss.mil> wrote in message
news:WQVTf.6493$a97.2200@newsread1.mlpsca01.us.to.verio.net...
> As Americans, we have a long and legendary history of welcoming and
> assimilating immigrants. This includes granting political asylum to those
> in
> flight from political persecution. But, as Americans,
jews who worship the phony state of israel cannot be Americans. Nor can an
ex Croatian ustasha be and American, unless he acts like an American and
supports the Constitution of United States which clearly recognizes the
premise that ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL!
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:12 am
From: "Pathfinder"
Muslems are loyal to Allah first...and America second. Christians are loyal
to Christ first..and the USA second....are they not not capable of being
Americans?
"serwad" <serwad@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:pq1Uf.318$yn4.194@bignews7.bellsouth.net...
>
> "DoD" <thecats@ss.mil> wrote in message
> news:WQVTf.6493$a97.2200@newsread1.mlpsca01.us.to.verio.net...
>> As Americans, we have a long and legendary history of welcoming and
>> assimilating immigrants. This includes granting political asylum to those
>> in
>> flight from political persecution. But, as Americans,
>
> jews who worship the phony state of israel cannot be Americans. Nor can an
> ex Croatian ustasha be and American, unless he acts like an American and
> supports the Constitution of United States which clearly recognizes the
> premise that ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL!
>
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Truth offends Arabs
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3eb82bdf273c49c9
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 8:04 pm
From: "rkusenet"
"Seeker" <4not_listed_due_to_spam_bots_121101@dont.reply> wrote in message
news:gaMTf.9447$z82.1343@fed1read07...
> Abbay, kuttiya ki harami aulaad, what does this have to with Pakistan and India, and other
> groups you manage to cross post this too.
>
> Kiya Islam nay teerey itni phardee kay tu abhi tak Islam kay sapnay daikh raha hai?
It is to elicit such response and see your irritation. Maza aa gaya.
Note to self: Job well done.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Government To Prosecute Communist Crimes
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/d44005fcb74047d9
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:22 pm
From: "paracho"
The same should be done in Croatia
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TOPIC: THE ULTIMATE BATTLE: MAN VS. DEVILS
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/42e17afd29f1834a
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:23 pm
From: "Chopsticks"
In the past few days, it has become obvious that Bush and Company are
running scare. And they should be. The cover for their lies is falling
apart. It looks like Karl Rove has either lost his zeal or run out of
lies to feed the American public.
C'mon folks! Wake up and look for yourself. Turn off the damn TV and
stop listening to propaganda spread by the American mainstream media
like ABC, NBC, etc Forget about Fox News. It's any but news. It is a
sad state of affair for the American people as their democracy has been
hijacked by corporate America, e.g. Exxon/Mobil and Halliburton.
Listen, the truth has been buried and choked by giant corporate
America. In fact, this has been the case for some years. Just think of
who has the real control of the US and it'll make sense. All you'll
have to do is to look at the style and tactics used in the past decades
and think who would be best known for these tactics in history. Who
would be the expert in turf war? Who would use intimidation and murder
and torture as their technique to "convince", persuade, and
eliminate their opponents? Who pray in the morning and kill in the
evening?
Is it coming back to you yet? If not, let me spell it out to you:
It's the organized crimes!
Only now, these thugs have evolved to an advanced level and have
infiltrated deep in the government. Since there's no bottom to their
greed, we are now seeing their reach globally. The early days these
thugs fought for the control of their neighborhood. Today they've
expanded or wish to expand globally. So, they've pushed real hard for
a cover called "free trade". The term is just another one of these
organized crimes' many deceptive schemes. They simply want to expand
their market and choke the local economy and democracy. Ultimately,
what'll remain in the "infected" country that is victimized by
these organized crime thugs is a total dictatorship, in which the
so-called government is just a symbolic body that is under total
control of the organized crime bosses!
Now back to the current affair in the US. The Americans are waking to
the lies Bush, Cheney, and the gang have fed them. No weapon of mass
destruction, no proof of connection between Saddam Hussein (and Iraqi)
to 9-11, no yellow cakes! All these things have been used to scare the
Americans to wage a war against a country that never attacked the US or
its interests. This by itself is a serious violation of the
Constitution. Yet, the American people are still in deep illusion that
Bush and the gang were "protecting them". In the contrary, BushCo
has done great damage to the image of America AND caused more people to
hate America, hence greater chance for terrorist attacks. Instead of
wining the Iraqi' hearts and minds, the US forces, under the
direction of a moron and arrogant son of a bitch named Ron Rumsfeld,
have committed many of the ugliest crimes against humanity during their
illegal invasion and occupation in Iraq. This kind of tyranny and
barbaric behaviors only reinforces the claim that the US government is
now nothing more than an arm of the organized crime groups in America.
War profiteering and immorality dominate the style and theme we've
observed throughout the Iraq war. Halliburton, a Cheney's operation,
has cashed in billions of dollars from the disgrace actions in Iraq.
Halliburton has been known to cheat the government (taxpayers' money)
and feed the troops contaminated foods and water. Yet, no punishment or
corrective action was made by the Bush government. In fact, Halliburton
takes the attitude that it is above the law. Imagine the looting scenes
we've seen in LA riots and New Orleans' Katrina aftermath. America
has been looted in a much bigger sense by Halliburton and the weapon
industry in the fiasco created by Bush and his gang.
The bottom line is how much money and power would these scumbags evil
bastards have to have before they create a hell on earth for all of us?
The next question is how long does it take for the people to stand up
and say "enough is enough!"?
The only way to bring true peace to the world is to remove, eliminate,
destroy, or kill the power of evil possessed by the organized crime
scumbags in America today. Again, it's all about oil - not
democracy or free or any of the bullshit given by BushCo as an excuse
to destroy Iraq, as we've seen so far. Who ever still buy Bush's
lies is unfit for life - or at least a life of a dignify human being.
It's time, folks! It's time to raise up and destroy the devils. And
removing Bush-Cheney and Company is the first logical step. Since the
problem has escalated to global level, it's the job for all people on
this planet to band together and resist and destroy the force of evil
impose upon mankind by corporate America like Bechtel, Halliburton,
Microsoft, Monsanto, Union-Carbide, and Wal-Mart, etc.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: gun owners and nra proven wrong - again
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/113cc170f0e4312a
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:24 pm
From: "editor@netpath.net"
Harmony wrote:
>gn (gun nuts = gun owners + nra) have always argued that >gun criminals have a long history of non-gun based criminal->violence record. we all know that
>to be a bumptious nonsense repeated ad infinitum
Bull. If your claim that "average" people did murders just because
they had guns came even close to being true, federal (in)Justice Dept.
statistics wouldn't show murder in America so ghettoized to the black
ghetto that black Americans commit murder at EIGHT times the rate
European-Americans do - and black Americans die of murder at FIVE times
the rate European-Americans do. The only way for murder in America to
be so largely confined to a racial group of under 12% of the population
is for murder really to be something "typical" Americans just don't do!
No $4 to park! No $6 admission! http://www.INTERNET-GUN-SHOW.com
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TOPIC: ANOTHER US war Crime.. In cold blood...
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/2f8fc6c826a82cba
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:25 pm
From: "Richard"
All this tells me is that 90% of your Greek friends are anti Semites
and US haters. Big surprise! If the disgrace thing don't sound original
no more it's because you hear it a lot from the 90% who are not your
friends. Is that clear?
==============================================================================
TOPIC: When Moslems turn crazy
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/f67c93c500c4800a
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:26 pm
From: "Ordog"
Nusrat wrote:
> On 21 Mar 2006 03:44:32 -0800, "Ordog" <odbok001@sneakemail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >Emanuel Appel wrote:
> >
> >soc.culture.australian,soc.culture.british,soc.culture.canada,
> >soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.jewish,
> >soc.culture.nordic,soc.culture.usa aren't excellent NGs for trolling?
> >
> >So when Jews turn crazy they turn to Ortodoxy, to Zionism and to
> >Neoconservativism!
>
>
> Where has that happened, can you cite any examples.
See US foreign policies from year 2000 onwards, see FOX news, see the
totality of Arial Sharon's policies over Midddle East peace.
There is no point in listing every single event since the total sum of
them are going that way without an exeption.
Let me put it this way: Show me a single policy that provides an
exception to what I have said (including the Gaza withdrawal) if you
can and then we can discuss this further.
Good luck.
Ördög
Either the neocons go or civilisation does!
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Gay Jews are thriving in New York City
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/e37b06ddfaeb8960
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== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:27 am
From: "Salah Jafar"
Fuck you, they deserve the OVEN like every Jew I know of.
SJ
== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:32 pm
From: "Sheldon Liberman"
Salah Jafar wrote:
> Welcome to the mishpocha! Orthodox Gay Jews are thriving in New York City and around the world. A variety of resources serve our vibrant and growing community.
>
> Is it possible to be gay and frum (a religious observant Jew)? What does the Torah say about homosexuality? What can I do about sex as a frum gay Jew? Complete responses to these and other Frequently Asked Questions about being Gay and Frum are now available.
Why don't you stick to your camels and goats? Why upset tradition?
You can also read brief Comments by Orthodox Rabbis and others on the
subject.
>
> Check out the Gay and Lesbian Yeshiva and Day School Alumni Association which meets monthly to discuss matters of common interest. This group serves our community and provides a friendly, safe place for individuals to integrate their Jewish and gay identities and to meet others like us. For recorded information, please call anytime (212) 780-4656. Meeting schedule for winter/spring 2006:
>
> Thursday, February 23, at 8:30 pm: Join us as we welcome award-winning author Aryeh Lev Stollman. We will have a reading from his novel The Far Euphrates followed by Q&A, socializing and refreshments.
> The Far Euphrates is a Jewish tale of family dynamics and secrets as seen through the eyes of a teenage boy.
> " Remarkable both for Stollman's eloquently understated prose and for the ease with which he constructs his artful plot." - New York Times Book Review
> " The novel is filled with eccentric characters and detail, but it is Stollman's gorgeous prose that moves us." - Out Magazine
>
> ...Thursday, March 23, at 8:30 pm; Thursday, April 27, at 8:30 pm; Thursday, May 25, at 8:30 pm. Meetings are held on the 4th Thursday of each month (barring holiday conflicts) at the Gay & Lesbian Community Center. The Center is located at 208 West 13th Street (between 7th and 8th Avenues) in New York City (Manhattan).
>
> To join the confidential e-mail list for information about special events and upcoming meetings, send an e-mail to GLYDSA@hotmail.com.
>
> The film Trembling Before G-d is now available on DVD. The film is a documentary about orthodox gay and lesbian Jews. The Trembling Before G-d website has more information.
>
> The book Wrestling With God & Men: Homosexuality in the Jewish Tradition by Rabbi Steven Greenberg (Univ. of Wisconsin Press: 2004) is now available in bookstores and online.
>
> The book Judaism and Homosexuality: An Authentic Orthodox View by Rabbi Chaim Rapoport (Mitchell Vallentine & Company) is now available in bookstores and online.
>
> Click here for the article "Gay and Orthodox" by Naomi Grossman from the April 2001 issue of Moment Magazine and read comments by others and respond.
>
> POST YOUR IDEAS, THOUGHTS, FEELINGS AND COMMENTS ON BEING GAY AND JEWISH.
>
> Orthodykes, a support group for Orthodox and formerly Orthodox lesbian, bisexual and transgender women has formed in New York City and meets monthly. For recorded information about this group, or to speak with someone, please call at anytime (212) 539-8804 or send an e-mail to: info@orthodykes.org
>
> In California, Orthodox and Traditional gay and lesbian Jews meet the third Sunday of the month in Los Angeles for socializing, education and support. For more details contact Steve, (562) 426-7756 or ar815@lafn.org
>
> A great page for GAY YOUTH has been set up. Check it out at JQYouth.
>
> There are several resources in Jerusalem. Check out the Jerusalem Open House and The Gay and Lesbian Student Union of the Hebrew University - Ha'asiron Ha'acher, which also has a great web page. Another web page for religious Jews in Jerusalem is OrthodoxGays. Have a look!
>
> Conservative Rabbi Harold Schulweis has written two thoughtful articles: Morality, Legality and Homosexuality and A Second Look at Homosexuality. These articles are highly recommended. Another essay by an Oxford Rabbi also may be of interest. Have a look.
>
> An on-line discussion list called frumgays has been established through Shamash. This list is available by subscription and is a safe space. For more information, contact Shamash through its web site.
>
> If you are sexually active, learn about and practice SAFER SEX every time. Safer Sex means knowing how HIV is transmitted and taking precautions to reduce your risk of getting HIV and other sexually transmitted diseases. HIV is transmitted in body fluids such as semen, vaginal fluid and blood. If you have anal sex, always use a latex rubber condom with water-based lubricant.
>
> If you think you may have been exposed to HIV but have not been tested, now may be the time to do it. There are medications available which make the possibility of a longer, healthier life a reality. If you are apprehensive about getting tested, or have any questions that you need answered about HIV or AIDS, call the Tzvi Aryeh AIDS Foundation, which provides support and programs for all Jews, gay and straight, from secular to Orthodox and Chassidic. The Foundation provides information, makes referrals and is available to answer questions in English, Hebrew, Yiddish and Russian. It also offers a kosher food program for homebound people with AIDS, a friendly visitor and buddy network, and understanding Rabbis from all denominations for counseling. For more information call 212-866-6306 anytime or e-mail TzviAryeh@aol.com or write to P.O. Box 150, Cathedral Station, New York, NY 10025.
>
> For additional information about our community, please contact via e-mail GayJews@aol.com.
>
> "And G-d saw all that He had made, and found it very good." (Bereshit 1:31).
>
> "It is not good for man to be alone." (Bereshit 2:18).
>
> "Master of the world, I am Yours and my dreams are Yours. I have dreamed a dream and I don't know what it means. May it be Your will that all my dreams regarding myself and regarding all of Israel be good ones, those that I have dreamed about myself, those that I have dreamed about others, and those that others have dreamed about me." (Birkat Kohanim).
>
> "In the path that a person wants to follow, Heaven leads
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Salah Jafar projecting his latent Homosexuality again?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/3a3e2a77a85b1e49
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:28 am
From: "Salah Jafar"
My desire is to fuck every Jew and put his ass in OVEN
SJ
==============================================================================
TOPIC: Mr. Bush Says Troops to Stay in Iraq Through His Presidency. Why?
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/a324bc7e5701fadf
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== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 22 2006 1:28 am
From: acoustic@panix.com (lo yeeOn)
In article <dvq042$4d7$1@news.datemas.de>, LoneStar <ewyatt@excite.com> wrote:
>
><rbbomber@netzero.com> wrote in message
>news:1142979928.502260.266070@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>> Mr. Bush's assertion that our troops will be in Iraq through 2008
>> has several meanings.
>
>I watched the entire news conference, and he did NOT say anything
>about keeping soldiers in Iraq past 2008. It was deduced that way,
>but his point was that he didn't want to stick a future president
>with a timeline for withdrawal. The news media just loves to put
>words in his mouth. EW
Are you sure you got it right? That's not what it was reported.
And what you thought he said, that his point was that he didn't want
to stick a future president with a timeline for withdrawal, doesn't
make much sense because he, as commander-in-chief, could recall the
troops whenever he wants. Judging by the sentiment of the Iraqis as
well as the desire of the deployed troops, any move on his part in
this direction would be undoubtedly most welcome.
It is clear that he want our soldiers to continue to die there in
order to secure the oil and the enduring bases he invaded Iraq for.
When Nixon decided to bring our troops home from Vietnam, he sent the
planes over to Saigon to pick them up. He didn't have to do anything
to encumber his successors (Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, or Ronald
Reagan).
In fact, your claim sounds quite orwellian by casting his refusal to
consider bringing home troops during the next 3 years as some kind of
benevolent act in consideration for his successor(s).
In further fact, in a fit of bravado sounding every bit like the cry
of a desparate man, he exclaimed:
I'm optimistic we'll succeed. If not, I'd pull our troops out.
So, he claimed he would pull our troops out *himself* anytime he wants
to.
WASHINGTON - President Bush said Tuesday that American forces will
remain in Iraq for years and it will be up to a future president to
decide when to bring them all home. But defying critics and plunging
polls, he declared, "I'm optimistic we'll succeed. If not, I'd pull
our troops out."
The president rejected calls for the resignation of Defense
Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, chief architect of wars in Iraq and
Afghanistan. ``Listen, every war plan looks good on paper until
you meet the enemy, . . .''
So, you'll find no altruistic reason behind his continued refusal to
consider bring our troops home.
lo yeeOn
========
# Expanding Bases Put Focus on U.S. in Iraq - Yahoo! News
By CHARLES J. HANLEY, AP Special Correspondent Tue Mar 21, 11:48 AM ET
BALAD AIR BASE, Iraq - The concrete goes on forever, vanishing into
the noonday glare, 2 million cubic feet of it, a mile-long slab that's
now the home of up to 120 U.S. helicopters, a "heli-park" as good as
any back in the States. At another giant base, al-Asad in
Iraq's western desert, the 17,000 troops and workers come and go in a
kind of bustling American town, with a Burger King, Pizza Hut and a
car dealership, stop signs, traffic regulations and young bikers
clogging the roads.
At a third hub down south, Tallil, they're planning a new mess hall,
one that will seat 6,000 hungry airmen and soldiers for chow.
Are the Americans here to stay? Air Force mechanic Josh Remy is sure
of it as he looks around Balad.
"I think we'll be here forever," the 19-year-old airman from
Wilkes-Barre, Pa., told a visitor to his base.
The Iraqi people suspect the same. Strong majorities tell pollsters
they'd like to see a timetable for U.S. troops to leave, but believe
Washington plans to keep military bases in their country.
The question of America's future in Iraq looms larger as the U.S.
military enters the fourth year of its war here, waged first to oust
President Saddam Hussein, and now to crush an Iraqi insurgency.
Ibrahim al-Jaafari, interim prime minister, has said he opposes
permanent foreign bases. A wide range of American opinion is against
them as well. Such bases would be a "stupid" provocation, says Gen.
Anthony Zinni, former U.S. Mideast commander and a critic of the
original U.S. invasion.
But events, in explosive situations like Iraq's, can turn "no" into
"maybe" and even "yes."
The Shiite Muslims, ascendant in Baghdad, might decide they need
long-term U.S. protection against insurgent Sunni Muslims. Washington
might take the political risks to gain a strategic edge -- in its
confrontation with next-door Iran, for example.
The U.S. ambassador to Iraq, Zalmay Khalilzad, and other U.S.
officials disavow any desire for permanent bases. But long-term
access, as at other U.S. bases abroad, is different from "permanent,"
and the official U.S. position is carefully worded.
Lt. Cmdr. Joe Carpenter, a Pentagon spokesman on international
security, told The Associated Press it would be "inappropriate" to
discuss future basing until a new Iraqi government is in place,
expected in the coming weeks.
Less formally, U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, asked about
"permanent duty stations" by a Marine during an Iraq visit in
December, allowed that it was "an interesting question." He said it
would have to be raised by the incoming Baghdad government, if "they
have an interest in our assisting them for some period over time."
In Washington, Iraq scholar Phebe Marr finds the language intriguing.
"If they aren't planning for bases, they ought to say so," she said.
"I would expect to hear 'No bases.'"
Right now what is heard is the pouring of concrete.
In 2005-06, Washington has authorized or proposed almost $1 billion
for U.S. military construction in Iraq, as American forces consolidate
at Balad, known as Anaconda, and a handful of other installations, big
bases under the old regime.
They have already pulled out of 34 of the 110 bases they were holding
last March, said Maj. Lee English of the U.S. command's Base Working
Group, planning the consolidation.
"The coalition forces are moving outside the cities while continuing
to provide security support to the Iraqi security forces," English
said.
The move away from cities, perhaps eventually accompanied by U.S.
force reductions, will lower the profile of U.S. troops, frequent
targets of roadside bombs on city streets. Officers at Al-Asad Air
Base, 10 desert miles from the nearest town, say it hasn't been hit by
insurgent mortar or rocket fire since October.
Al-Asad will become even more isolated. The proposed 2006 supplemental
budget for Iraq operations would provide $7.4 million to extend the
no-man's-land and build new security fencing around the base, which at
19 square miles is so large that many assigned there take the Yellow
or Blue bus routes to get around the base, or buy bicycles at a PX
jammed with customers.
The latest budget also allots $39 million for new airfield lighting,
air traffic control systems and upgrades allowing al-Asad to plug into
the Iraqi electricity grid -- a typical sign of a long-term base.
At Tallil, besides the new $14 million dining facility, Ali Air Base
is to get, for $22 million, a double perimeter security fence with
high-tech gate controls, guard towers and a moat -- in military
parlance, a "vehicle entrapment ditch with berm."
Here at Balad, the former Iraqi air force academy 40 miles north of
Baghdad, the two 12,000-foot runways have become the logistics hub for
all U.S. military operations in Iraq, and major upgrades began last
year.
Army engineers say 31,000 truckloads of sand and gravel fed nine
concrete-mixing plants on Balad, as contractors laid a $16 million
ramp to park the Air Force's huge C-5 cargo planes; an $18 million
ramp for workhorse C-130 transports; and the vast, $28 million main
helicopter ramp, the length of 13 football fields, filled with attack,
transport and reconnaissance helicopters.
Turkish builders are pouring tons more concrete for a fourth ramp
beside the runways, for medical-evacuation and other aircraft on
alert. And $25 million was approved for other "pavement projects,"
from a special road for munitions trucks to a compound for special
forces.
The chief Air Force engineer here, Lt. Col. Scott Hoover, is also
overseeing two crucial projects to add to Balad's longevity: equipping
the two runways with new permanent lighting, and replacing a weak
3,500-foot section of one runway.
Once that's fixed, "we're good for as long as we need to run it,"
Hoover said. Ten years? he was asked. "I'd say so."
Away from the flight lines, among traffic jams and freshly planted
palms, life improves on 14-square-mile Balad for its estimated 25,000
personnel, including several thousand American and other civilians.
They've inherited an Olympic-sized pool and a chandeliered cinema from
the Iraqis. They can order their favorite Baskin-Robbins flavor at ice
cream counters in five dining halls, and cut-rate Fords, Chevys or
Harley-Davidsons, for delivery at home, at a PX-run "dealership." On
one recent evening, not far from a big 24-hour gym, airmen hustled up
and down two full-length, lighted outdoor basketball courts as F-16
fighters thundered home overhead.
"Balad's a fantastic base," Brig. Gen. Frank Gorenc, the Air Force's
tactical commander in Iraq, said in an interview at his headquarters
here.
Could it host a long-term U.S. presence?
"Eventually it could," said Gorenc, commander of the 332nd Air
Expeditionary Wing. "But there's no commitment to any of the bases we
operate, until somebody tells me that."
In the counterinsurgency fight, Balad's central location enables
strike aircraft to reach targets in minutes. And in the broader
context of reinforcing the U.S. presence in the oil-rich Mideast, Iraq
bases are preferable to aircraft carriers in the Persian Gulf, said a
longtime defense analyst.
"Carriers don't have the punch," said Gordon Adams of Washington's
George Washington University. "There's a huge advantage to land-based
infrastructure. At the level of strategy it makes total sense to have
Iraq bases."
A U.S. congressional study cited another, less discussed use for
possible Iraq bases: to install anti-ballistic defenses in case Iran
fires missiles.
American bases next door could either deter or provoke Iran, noted
Paul D. Hughes, a key planner in the early U.S. occupation of Iraq.
Overall, however, this retired Army colonel says American troops are
unwanted in the Middle East. With long-term bases in Iraq, "We'd be
inviting trouble," Hughes said.
"It's a stupid idea and clearly politically unacceptable," Zinni, a
former Central Command chief, said in a Washington interview. "It
would damage our image in the region, where people would decide that
this" -- seizing bases -- "was our original intent."
Among Iraqis, the subject is almost too sensitive to discuss.
"People don't like bases," veteran politician Adnan Pachachi, a member
of the new Parliament, told the AP. "If bases are absolutely
necessary, if there's a perceived threat ... but I don't think even
Iran will be a threat."
If long-term basing is, indeed, on the horizon, "the politics back
here and the politics in the region say, 'Don't announce it,'" Adams
said in Washington. That's what's done elsewhere, as with the quiet
U.S. basing of spy planes and other aircraft in the United Arab
Emirates.
Army and Air Force engineers, with little notice, have worked to give
U.S. commanders solid installations in Iraq, and to give policymakers
options. From the start, in 2003, the first Army engineers rolling
into Balad took the long view, laying out a 10-year plan envisioning a
move from tents to today's living quarters in air-conditioned
trailers, to concrete-and-brick barracks by 2008.
In early 2006, no one's confirming such next steps, but a Balad
"master plan," details undisclosed, is nearing completion, a possible
model for al-Asad, Tallil and a fourth major base, al-Qayyarah in
Iraq's north.
___
EDITOR'S NOTE -- This report is based on interviews with U.S. military
engineers and others before and during the writer's two weeks as an
embedded reporter at major U.S. bases in Iraq.
AP Investigative Researcher Randy Herschaft contributed to this
report.
#Bush suggests US troops will still be in Iraq into 2009 - Yahoo!
WASHINGTON (AFP) -
President George W. Bush hinted at a years-long US deployment in
Iraq, saying that future US presidents and Iraqi governments would
decide when the last US soldiers leave that war-torn country.
But Bush, who leaves office in January 2009, used a wide-ranging press
conference to assure a US public unhappy with the war effort that he
would call US troops home if he thought victory was impossible.
Asked whether all US forces would someday come home, the embattled US
president said: "That, of course, is an objective. And that will be
decided by future presidents and future governments of Iraq."
Bush also hinted at rifts in the diplomatic approach to Iran's
nuclear program, saying that Britain, France, Germany, Russia, China
and the United States would meet later this week "to make sure that
the message remains unified and concerted."
"It's important for our citizens to understand that we've got to deal
with this issue diplomatically now," he said. "If the Iranians were to
have a nuclear weapon, they could blackmail the world."
Russia and China, both veto-wielding permanent UN Security Council
members, have resisted calls for the council to pressure Iran over its
nuclear power program. Tehran denies US charges it secretly seeks
atomic weapons.
Bush also said that the United States would make clear, in any talks
with Iran about the situation in Iraq, that Washington viewed efforts
to stoke sectarian violence and help arm insurgents as "unacceptable."
"This is a way for us to make it clear to them about what's right or
wrong in their activities inside of Iraq," said the president, who
denied that the strife-torn country had slipped into civil war.
"There's going to be more tough fighting ahead," he said, but "the
Iraqis took a look and decided not to go to civil war" after the
attack on a revered Shiite Muslim shrine.
"I'm optimistic we'll succeed. If not, I'd pull our troops out. If I
didn't believe we had a plan for victory, I wouldn't leave our people
in harm's way," he said. "I wouldn't put those kids there."
Some 2,300 US soldiers have been killed and many more wounded since
the war in Iraq began almost exactly three years ago, and the
open-ended conflict has dragged Bush's poll numbers to some of their
lowest levels ever.
The press conference came as some in his Republican party have worried
that his unpopularity may drag down their prospects to retain control
over the US Senate and House of Representatives in November mid-term
elections.
For the second straight day, Bush took on critics who say his sunny
forecasts for Iraq are out of touch with the bloody daily reality,
insisting he was "realistic" and warning against a hasty US
withdrawal.
And for what may have been the first time, the president said he knew
things in Iraq were difficult because "I hear it from our troops" --
not only the media he has accused of focusing on violence rather than
progress.
Bush, who has repeatedly said that US soldiers will come home only as
Iraq's fledgling security forces can replace them, warned that a hasty
withdrawal would embolden terrorists and discourage reformers in the
Muslim world.
"If people in Iran, for example, who desire to have an Iranian-style
democracy, Iranian-style freedom, if they see us lose our nerve, it's
likely to undermine their boldness and their desire," he said.
"A democracy in Iraq is going to affect the neighborhood. A democracy
in Iraq is going to inspire reformers in a part of the world that is
desperate for reformation," he said.
Amid mounting calls for a staff shake up at the White House, the
president also rejected calls for Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld's
removal, saying "I don't believe he should resign. I think he's done a
fine job."
But Bush suggested that he might make a change, saying: "I'm not going
to announce it right now."
===
WASHINGTON - President Bush said Tuesday that American forces will
remain in Iraq for years and it will be up to a future president to
decide when to bring them all home. But defying critics and plunging
polls, he declared, "I'm optimistic we'll succeed. If not, I'd pull
our troops out."
The president rejected calls for the resignation of Defense Secretary
Donald Rumsfeld, chief architect of wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.
"Listen, every war plan looks good on paper until you meet the enemy,"
Bush said, acknowledging mistakes as the United States was forced to
switch tactics and change a reconstruction strategy that offered
targets for insurgents.
He also rejected assertions by Iraq's former interim prime minister
that the country had fallen into civil war amid sectarian violence
that has left more than 1,000 Iraqis dead since the bombing last month
of a Shiite Muslim shrine.
"This is a moment the Iraqis had a chance to fall apart and they
didn't," Bush said, crediting religious and political leaders with
restraint.
The president spoke for nearly an hour at a White House news
conference, part of a new offensive to ease Americans' unhappiness
with the war and fellow Republicans' anxiety about fall elections. He
faced skeptical questions about Iraq during an appearance Monday in
Cleveland, and plans another address soon on Iraq.
Public support for the war and for Bush himself has fallen in recent
months, jeopardizing the political capital he claimed from his 2004
re-election victory. "I'd say I'm spending that capital on the war,"
Bush said.
The White House believes that people appreciate Bush's plainspoken
approach even if they disagree with his decisions.
"I understand war creates concerns," the president said. "Nobody likes
war. It creates a sense of uncertainty in the country."
Bush has adamantly refused to set a deadline for the withdrawal of
U.S. forces from Iraq. Asked if there would come a day when there
would be no more U.S. forces in Iraq, Bush said, "That, of course, is
an objective. And that will be decided by future presidents and future
governments of Iraq."
Pressed on whether that meant a complete withdrawal would not happen
during his presidency, Bush said, "I can only tell you that I will
make decisions on force levels based upon what the commanders on the
ground say."
White House officials worried Bush's remarks would be read as saying
there would not be significant troop reductions during his presidency.
They pointed to comments Sunday by Gen. George W. Casey, commander of
U.S. forces in Iraq, who said he expected a substantial troop
reduction "certainly over the course of 2006 and into 2007."
The Pentagon announced last December that U.S. force levels would be
reduced from the baseline figure of about 138,000 to about 131,000 by
the end of March. The total currently is 133,000. In late February
the Pentagon told Congress that "it will be possible to consider"
additional reductions as the political process moves forward and as
Iraqi security forces gain experience. No timetable has been set for
deciding on additional cuts.
More than 2,300 American troops have died in Iraq. At home, nearly
four of five people, including 70 percent of Republicans, believe
civil war will break out in Iraq, according to a recent AP-Ipsos poll.
"I am confident -- I believe, I'm optimistic we'll succeed," the
president said. "If not, I'd pull our troops out. If I didn't believe
we had a plan for victory I wouldn't leave our people in harm's way."
Bush said U.S. forces were essential for the stability of Iraq and
restraining al-Qaida in the Middle East.
"Their objective for driving us out of Iraq is to have a place from
which to launch their campaign to overthrow moderate governments in
the Middle East, as well as to continue attacking places like the
United States," he said.
Despite pleas from fellow Republicans, Bush has rejected calls for a
White House staff shake-up, saying he was satisfied with his aides. He
did not rule out bringing in a savvy Washington insider, as some have
suggested, but said, "I'm not going to announce it right now." Aides
said later he was not trying to signal any appointment.
Bush defended his administration's warrantless eavesdropping program
whose legality has been questioned by Democrats and Republicans alike.
Putting his remarks in a political context, he said, "Nobody from the
Democratic Party has actually stood up and called for getting rid of
the of the terrorist surveillance program."
Bush accused Wisconsin Sen. Russ Feingold of "needless partisanship"
for urging censure of the president for authorizing the surveillance
program.
On the economy, Bush sidestepped a direct answer when asked whether he
was concerned about rising interest rates. He simply said the U.S.
economy was very strong. He expressed disappointment that Congress
shelved his Social Security overhaul and said the system won't be
changed without the cooperation of Democrats and Republicans together.
===
New York Daily News - Home - Soldiers' families dubious of Dubya
Propelled by anguish and impatience, three local families who lost
soldiers in Iraq questioned the sincerity of President Bush's
"reflections" on the third anniversary of the war.
In public remarks yesterday, Bush said he spent the morning thinking
about "the sacrifices of the men and women who wear our uniform."
The families, who were quick to pledge their unwavering support to all
U.S. armed forces, said the words rang hollow.
"She's upset with the President, with the war. She says maybe we
shouldn't have been [in Iraq] to begin with," said Queens resident
Hyda Hernandez, 41, translating for her heartbroken Queens mom,
Amarilys Hernandez, 65. "She has not gotten over the loss of her
baby."
Marine Cpl. Robert Rodriguez, Amarilys Hernandez's youngest son, was
just 21 when he became the first New York casualty of the war on March
25, 2003.
Rodriguez was riding in an Abrams tank that fell under heavy artillery
fire and was forced off a bridge into the Euphrates River.
"The President is always talking about his support for the troops. But
he doesn't know what the soldiers are going through," said Hyda
Hernandez, of Maspeth.
"I don't think Bush is sincere," said Jessica Irizarry, who lost her
Bronx husband, Sgt. Henry Irizarry, to a roadside bomb on Dec. 3,
2004. "We've lost a lot of people in Iraq, and we don't see any
change. The war was the wrong decision. It's not changing anything."
The 26-year-old widow, who now lives in Connecticut, said she still
has trouble explaining her husband's absence to 6-year-old son Jacob.
"I don't think [Bush] understands the sacrifice the families have
made," said Zulfiqar Ali, 35, whose younger brother, Spec. Azhar Ali,
21, died when a roadside bomb ripped through his Humvee in Baghdad on
March 2, 2005.
"If [Bush] knew how to end this, he probably would have done it a long
time ago," he said from his home in Flushing, Queens. "After my
brother, so many more young kids have died. I feel so sorry for them.
... I feel like the time to bring them back was a long time ago."
Originally published on March 20, 2006
===
Straight talk on Bush - The Boston Globe
By Scot Lehigh, Globe Columnist | March 21, 2006
THE MOST UNLIKELY page-turner I read on my winter vacation?
It was ''Impostor: How George W. Bush Bankrupted America and Betrayed
the Reagan Legacy," by former Reagan administration official Bruce
Bartlett.
When party and principles clash, loyalty to team typically trumps
fidelity to tenets, while rationalization usually supplants
ratiocination. Not in this case, however. Bartlett values his ideals
enough to speak important truths about a president of his own party.
From the policy-generation process to tax cuts to spending to free
trade, the author portrays the Bush record as dismal. Because
partisanship imparts a certain imperviousness to facts (on both sides
of the ideological aisle), criticisms of this administration are too
often shrugged off, at least by the right-wing talk-radio crowd, as
political carping.
It will be hard to dismiss Bartlett's book that way. A confirmed
Reaganite, he not only worked in the Gipper's White House but went on
to serve as deputy assistant secretary for economic policy during the
last few months of Reagan's presidency and all of George H.W. Bush's.
One particularly troubling trait of the current White House, Bartlett
writes, has been its ''total subordination of analysis to short-term
politics." A second ''is a disregard for established economic agencies
and total reliance on a small cadre of White House staffers, many with
no substantive economic backgrounds, who regularly overrule those with
experience and expertise on issues under discussion."
And consider the honesty it takes for a conservative to make this
point: When it comes to fiscal responsibility, Bill Clinton's record
is better than George W. Bush's.
Praising Clinton for deficit reduction, spending discipline, federal
workforce reductions, and welfare reform, Bartlett writes that ''for
those reasons, growing numbers of conservatives now view Clinton as
having governed as one of them -- at least on economic policy."
One shortcoming: Although Bartlett criticizes the Bush tax cuts as
poorly designed, he never quite acknowledges how much of the huge
yearly budget deficits result from them.
From fiscal year 2001 through fiscal year 2005, ''tax cuts and new
spending contributed roughly equally to the increase in the deficit,"
says Robert Bixby, executive director of the Concord Coalition, a
nonpartisan budgetary watchdog.
Bartlett, who labels George W. Bush ''one of the most free-spending
presidents on record," is focused much more on that aspect of the
ledger.
He's particularly exercised about the Medicare prescription drug
benefit. That legislation was billed as a plan that would cost $400
billion over its first 10 years. However, it quickly turned out that
the true cost of the bill had been concealed. The real price tag for
the first 10 years is $557 billion. Meanwhile, a more representative
decade-long cost, for the years from 2006 to 2015, is now put at more
than $700 billion.
That benefit alone will consume 1.9 percent of gross domestic product
virtually forever, Bartlett says. ''In 2005, this would have come to
$232 billion -- more than all the corporate income taxes collected by
the federal government and 26 percent of all personal income taxes,"
he writes. ''In other words, the individual income tax would have to
rise by 26 percent immediately and forever just to pay for the drug
program."
It's worth noting that if Bush has been a spendthrift, the Democrats
have hardly distinguished themselves. One depressing memory of the
2004 presidential campaign was watching the Democratic candidates
tumble over themselves in their hurry to tell seniors that the new
drug benefit simply wasn't generous enough.
Bartlett underscores another important idea: Although Bush likes to
style himself a tax-cutter, in reality his borrow-and-spend fiscal
policies have made a future tax hike virtually inevitable.
Or, to put it another way, because they haven't held spending to what
revenues will support, Bush and Congress are sending part of the tab
for current programs to future taxpayers, who will eventually have to
make good our bills.
''Bush may turn out to be extraordinarily lucky and avoid having to
face the consequences of his own fiscal actions, especially the hugely
ill-conceived Medicare drug bill, and the burden of enacting a major
tax increase may fall on his successor," Bartlett writes. ''But it
will be Bush's fault even if someone else ends up paying the political
price."
It may not be everyone's idea of a race-through beach read, but
Bartlett's is a thought-provoking book -- one that merits more
attention than apologists for this administration are likely to give
it.
Scot Lehigh's e-mail address is lehigh@globe.com.
) Copyright 2006 Globe Newspaper Company.
==============================================================================
TOPIC: THE SKY IS WEEPING FOR THE FIRST AMENDMENT
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/browse_thread/thread/baf027c3f635c5c0
==============================================================================
== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Tues, Mar 21 2006 5:38 pm
From: "serwad"
The death of a writer
When she died on March 16, 2003, Rachel Corrie had been in the Middle East
for fifty days as a member of the International Solidarity Movement (ISM), a
group recruiting Westerners to serve as "human shields" against Israeli
aggression - including the policy of bulldozing Palestinian houses to create
a wider no man's land between Egypt and then-occupied Gaza. Corrie was
crushed to death when she stood in front of a bulldozer that was proceeding
toward a Palestinian pharmacist's house. By witnesses' accounts, Corrie,
wearing a bright orange vest, was clearly visible to the bulldozer's driver.
An Israeli army investigation held no one accountable.
Corrie's horrifying death was a landmark event: It linked Palestinian
suffering to the American progressive movement. And it was immediately
politicized. Pro-Israel voices sought to smear Corrie as a servant of
terrorists. They said that the Israeli army was merely trying to block
tunnels through which weapons were brought from Egypt into the occupied
territories - thereby denying that Corrie had died as the result of
indiscriminate destruction. Hateful e-mails were everywhere. "Rachel Corrie
won't get 72 virgins but she got what she wanted," said one.
Few knew that Corrie had been a dedicated writer. "I decided to be an artist
and a writer," she had written in a journal, describing her awakening, "and
I didn't give a shit if I was mediocre and I didn't give a shit if I starved
to death and I didn't give a shit if my whole damn high school turned and
pointed and laughed in my face."
Corrie's family felt it most urgent to get her words out to the world. The
family posted several of her last e-mails on the ISM website (and they were
printed in full by the London Guardian). These pieces were electrifying.
They revealed a passionate and poetical woman who had long been attracted to
idealistic causes and had put aside her work with the mentally ill and
environmental causes in the Pacific Northwest to take up a pressing concern,
Palestinian human rights. Thousands responded to the Corries, including a
representative of the Royal Court Theatre in Sloane Square, London, who
asked if the theater could use Rachel's words in a production - and, oh, are
there more writings? Cindy Corrie could do little more than sit and drink
tea. She had family tell the Royal Court, Give us time.
It was another year before Sarah Corrie dragged out the tubs in which her
sister had stored her belongings and typed passages from journals and
letters going back to high school. In November 2004 the Corries sent 184
pages to the Royal Court.
It had been the intention of the two collaborators, Alan Rickman and
Katharine Viner, a Guardian editor, to flesh out Rachel Corrie's writings
with others' words. The pages instantly changed their minds. "We thought,
She's done it on her own. Rachel's voice is the only voice you had to hear,"
Viner says. The Corrie family, which holds the rights to the words, readily
agreed. Rachel Corrie was the playwright. Any royalties would go to the
Rachel Corrie Foundation for Peace and Justice. The London "co-editors" then
set to work winnowing the material, working with a slender blond actress,
Megan Dodds, who resembles Corrie.
A year ago the play was staged as a one-woman show in a 100-seat theater at
the Royal Court. The piece was critically celebrated, and the four-week run
sold out. Young people especially were drawn to the show.
My Name Is Rachel Corrie - the title comes from a declaration in Corrie's
journal - is two things: the self-portrait of a sensitive woman struggling
to find her purpose, and a polemic on the horrors of Israeli occupation.
The work is marked by Plath-like talk about boys - "Eventually I convinced
Colin to quit drowning out my life" - and rilling passages about her growing
understanding of commitment: "I knew a few years ago what the unbearable
lightness of being was, before I read the book. The lightness between life
and death, there are no dimensions at all.. It's just a shrug, the
difference between Hitler and my mother, the difference between Whitney
Houston and a Russian mother watching her son fall through the sidewalk and
boil to death.. And I knew back then that the shrug would happen at the end
of my life - I knew. And I thought, so who cares?. Now I know, who cares.if
I die at 11.15 p.m. or at 97 years - And I know it's me. That's my job." As
the work grinds toward death, Corrie's moral vision of the Mideast becomes
uppermost. "What we are paying for here is truly evil.. This is not the
world you and Dad wanted me to come into when you decided to have me."
'Mollifying' the opposition
The show returned last fall to a larger theater at the Royal Court, and sold
out again. Most viewers tended to walk off afterward in stunned silence, but
some nights the theater became a forum for discussions. Rickman or Viner or
Dodds came out to talk about how the show had come about.
The Royal Court got bids from around the world, including a theater in
Israel, seeking to stage the production. But the priority was to bring the
show to "Rachel's homeland," as Elyse Dodgson, the theater's international
director, says. At bottom, Corrie's story feels very American. It is filled
with references that surely escaped its English audience - working at Mount
Rainier, swimming naked in Puget Sound, drinking Mountain Dew, driving I-5
to California.
The New York Theatre Workshop agreed to stage the show in March 2006. But by
January the Royal Court began to sense apprehension on the Workshop's part.
"I went to New York to meet them because I didn't feel comfortable about
what they were saying," Dodgson says.
The Workshop was evidently spooked. Its artistic director, James Nicola,
spoke of having discussions after every performance to "contextualize" the
play, of hiring a consultant who had worked with Salman Rushdie to lead
these discussions and of hiring Emily Mann, the artistic director of the
McCarter Theatre in Princeton, New Jersey, to prepare a companion piece of
testimonies that would include Israeli victims of Palestinian terrorism.
"We've had some brilliant discussions, we told them, but the play speaks for
itself," Dodgson says. "It is expensive and unnecessary to have that after
every single performance. Of course we knew some of the hideous things that
were said about Rachel. We took no notice of them. The controversy died when
people saw that this was a play about a young woman, an idealist."
Dodgson was further upset when a Workshop marketing staffer, whom she won't
name, used the word "mollifying." "It was a very awkward conversation. He
said, 'I can't find the right word, but "mollifying" the Jewish community.'
It shocked me."
Corrie's connection to the International Solidarity Movement was politically
loaded. The ISM is committed to nonviolence, but it works with a broad range
of organizations, from Israeli peace activists to Palestinian groups that
have supported suicide bombings, which has been seized on by those who want
it to get lost.
At the heart of the disagreement was an insistence by supporters of Israel
that Corrie's killing be presented in the context of Palestinian terror. And
that specifically, the policy of destroying Palestinian homes in Gaza be
shown to be aimed at those tunnels - even though the pharmacist's house
Corrie was shielding was hundreds of yards from the border and had nothing
to do with tunnels. One person close to NYTW, who refused to go on the
record, elaborates: "The fact that the Israelis and such were trying to
bulldoze these houses was not due to the fact that they were just against
the Palestinians, but the underground tunnels, ways to get explosives to
this community. By not mentioning it, the play was not as evenhanded as it
claims to be." Another anonymous NYTW source said that staffers became
worried after reading a fall 2003 Mother Jones profile of Corrie, a much
disputed piece that relied heavily on right-wing sources to paint her as a
reckless naif.
Just whom was the Workshop consulting in its deliberations? It has
steadfastly refused to say. In the New York Observer, Nicola mentioned
"Jewish friends." Dodgson says that in discussions with the Royal Court,
Workshop staffers brought up the Anti-Defamation League and the mayor's
office as entities they were concerned about. (Abe Foxman of the ADL visited
London in 2005 and denounced the play in the New York Sun as offensive to
Jewish "sensitivities.") By one account, the fatal blow was dealt when the
global PR firm Ruder Finn (which has an office in Israel) said it couldn't
represent the play.
In its latest statement, the Workshop says it consulted many community
voices, not only Jews. These did not include Arab-Americans. Najla Said, the
artistic director of Nibras, an Arab-American theater in New York, says,
"We're not even 'other' enough to be 'other.' We're not the political issue
that anyone thinks is worth talking about."
The run had been scheduled for March 22-May 14. Tickets were listed on
Telecharge in February. But the Workshop had not announced the production.
According to the Royal Court, Nicola at last told them he wanted to postpone
the play at least six months or a year to allow the political climate to
settle down and to better prepare the production. The Royal Court took this
as a cancellation. The news broke on February 28 in the Guardian and the New
York Times.
The Times article was shocking. It said the Workshop had "delayed" a
production it had never announced, and reported that Nicola had been
"polling local Jewish religious and community leaders as to their feelings."
Nicola was quoted saying that Hamas's victory had made the Jewish community
"very defensive and very edgy.and that seemed reasonable to me."
The Red Sea parted. Or anyway the Atlantic Ocean. The English playwright
Caryl Churchill, who has worked with both theaters, condemned the decision.
Vanessa Redgrave wrote a letter urging the Royal Court to sue the Workshop.
At first, the New York theater community was quiet.
Enter the blogosphere, stage left. Three or four outraged theater bloggers
began peppering the Workshop's community with questions. Whom did the
Workshop talk to? Why aren't theater people up in arms? Garrett Eisler, the
blogger Playgoer, likened the decision to one by the Manhattan Theater Club
to cancel its 1998 production of Corpus Christi, a play imagining Christ as
a gay man - a decision that was reversed after leading voices, including the
Times editorial page, denounced the action.
The playwright Jason Grote circulated a petition calling on the Workshop to
reverse itself. Signers included Philip Munger, a composer whose cantata
dedicated to Corrie, The Skies Are Weeping, also had experienced politically
motivated cancellations. The young playwright Christopher Shinn spoke out
early and forcefully, saying the postponement amounted to censorship. "No
one with a name was saying anything," says Eisler. "And Chris Shinn is not
that big a name, but he is a practicing theater artist whose name gets in
the New York Times."
A 'ghastly' situation
By the time I visited the Workshop, a week into the controversy, it was a
wounded institution. Linda Chapman, the associate artistic director, who had
signed Grote's petition, said she couldn't talk to me, because of the
"quicksand" that any statement had become. The Workshop had posted and then
removed from its website a clumsy statement aimed at explaining itself.
Playgoer was demanding that the opponents of the play come forward and
drumming for a declaration from Tony Kushner, who has staged plays at the
Workshop, posting his photo as if he were some war criminal.
In an interview with The Nation, Kushner said that he was quiet because of
his exhaustion over similar arguments surrounding the film Munich, on which
he was a screenwriter, and because he kept hoping the decision would be made
right. He said Nicola is a great figure in American theater: "His is one of
the one or two most important theaters in this area - politically engaged,
unapologetic, unafraid and formally experimental." Never having gotten a
clear answer about why Nicola put off the play, Kushner ascribes it to
panic: Nicola didn't know what he was getting into, and only later became
aware of how much opposition there was to Corrie, how much confusion the
right has created around the facts. Nicola felt he was taking on "a really
big, scary brawl and not a play." Still, Kushner said, the theater's
decision created a "ghastly" situation. "Censoring a play because it
addresses Palestinian-Israeli issues is not in any way right," he said.
The Royal Court came out smelling like a rose. It triumphantly announced
that it was moving the Megan Dodds show to the West End, the London
equivalent of Broadway, and that it couldn't come to New York till next
fall.
The Grote petitioners (519 and counting) want that to happen at the
Workshop, which itself was reaching out with another statement on the
matter, released on the eve of the anniversary of Corrie's death. "I can
only say we were trying to do whatever we could to help Rachel's voice be
heard," Nicola said. The cut may be too deep for such ointment. As George
Hunka, author of the theater blog Superfluities, says, "This is far too
important an issue for everyone to paper it over again, with everyone
shaking hands for a New York Times photographer. It's an extraordinarily
rare picture of the ways that New York cultural institutions make their
decisions about what to produce."
Hunka doesn't use the J-word. Jen Marlowe does. A Jewish activist with
Rachelswords.org (which is staging a reading of Corrie's words on March 22
with the Corrie parents present), she says, "I don't want to say the Jewish
community is monolithic. It isn't. But among many American Jews who are very
progressive and fight deeply for many social justice issues, there's a
knee-jerk reflexive reaction that happens around issues related to Israel."
Questions about pressure from Jewish leaders morph quickly into questions
about funding. Ellen Stewart, the legendary director of the theatrical group
La MaMa E.T.C., which is across East 4th Street from the Workshop,
speculates that the trouble began with its "very affluent" board. Rachel's
father, Craig Corrie, echoes her. "Do an investigation, follow the money." I
called six board members and got no response. (About a third appear to be
Jewish, as am I.) This is of course a charged issue. The writer Alisa
Solomon, who was appalled by the postponement, nonetheless warns, "There's
something a little too familiar about the image of Jews pulling the puppet
strings behind the scenes."
Perhaps. But Nicola's statement about a back channel to Jewish leaders
suggests the presence of a cultural lobby that parallels the vaunted
pro-Israel lobby in think tanks and Congress. I doubt we will find out
whether the Workshop's decision was "internally generated," as Kushner
contends, or more orchestrated, as I suspect. What the episode has
demonstrated is a climate of fear. Not of physical harm, but of loss of
opportunities. "The silence results from fear and intimidation," says Cindy
Corrie. "I don't see what else. And it harms not only Palestinians. I
believe, from the bottom of my heart, it harms Israelis and it harms us."
Kushner agrees. Having spent five months defending Munich, he says the fear
has two sources: "There is a very, very highly organized attack machinery
that will come after you if you express any kind of dissent about Israel's
policies, and it's a very unpleasant experience to be in the cross hairs.
These aren't hayseeds from Kansas screaming about gays burning in hell;
they're newspaper columnists who are taken seriously." These attackers
impose a kind of literacy test: Before you can cast a moral vote on
Palestinian rights, you must be able to recite a million wonky facts, such
as what percentage of the territories were outside the Green Line in 1949.
Then there is the self-generated fear of lending support to anti-Semites or
those who would destroy Israel. All in all, says Kushner, it can leave
someone "overwhelmed and in despair - you feel like you should just say
nothing."
Who will tell Americans the Middle East story? For generations that story
has been one of Israelis as victims, and it has been crucial to Israeli
policy inasmuch as Israel has been able to defy its neighbors' opinions by
relying on a highly sympathetic superpower. Israel's supporters have always
feared that if Americans started to conduct the same frank discussion of
issues that takes place in Tel Aviv, we might become more evenhanded in our
approach to the Middle East. That pressure is what has stifled a play that
portrays the Palestinians as victims (and thrown a blanket over a movie,
Munich, that portrays both sides as victims). I've never written this sort
of thing before. How moving that we have been granted that freedom by a
23-year-old woman with literary gifts who was not given time to unpack them.
Philip Weiss is the author of American Taboo: A Murder in the Peace Corps.
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